Because at then end ,power over the people is given to the state. When you give the state the means of production and that state falls under the sway of humans with power, you get corruption and death.
Once a place has enough people, anonymity happens. We stop knowing our neighbors and leaders. We don’t see the corruption they can now hide. Communism gives an easier way to leverage that corruption and power more easily
Socialism, more specifically forms of democratic socialism ( and with today’s tech it can be one vite one person), is far more scalable and stable
We need a new constitution with more power given to the people and LESS to the state
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It’s not really about defending the bad stuff. It’s about trying to get some more nuance on perhaps the most propagandized topic of the 20th century.
There are all sorts of interesting discussions to have about the various failings of these countries amongst other leftists who have the relevant context as a starting point for a reasonable discussion.
But when talking to libs/conservatives, they’re coming into the conversation with an already extremely warped, un-nuanced perspective. “These are all evil dictatorships that were also super incompetent and that shows why communism is bad.”
Some of the stuff they base this on is either exaggerated or just straight up wrong. Some of it is completely valid criticism, but without the context to understand the issue or provide a useful critique.
How do you have any meaningful conversation about these countries without acknowledging things like:
- All of these countries were previously agrarian, un-democratic societies.
- Most of them were formerly exploited colonies who had to fight fairly brutal wars for their independence.
- Even after leaving, the imperialists kept messing with them through economic and diplomatic isolation and espionage including supporting right wing coups.
We don’t have the counterfactual where we see what these countries would have turned out like without these challenges, but it’s an incomplete analysis to not at least consider the ways which they impacted both their economic success and their political developments. Maybe you could argue there were better ways to respond to all of this, but hindsight is 20-20.
No actual leftists want to have to argue “authoritarianism was good actually.” But it’s hard for the conversation not to appear that way when we’re arguing with people who’ve been conditioned to think they’re somehow as bad or worse than Nazis and ending the thought there.
communism isn’t bad, it just doesn’t scale up. after awhile someone wants everyone else’s stuff. When enough people gather together then anonymity becomes a thing. then those people start taking everyone else’s stuff and we end up with Russia.
I think what they think is that citizens have bad judgement, so it ends in Maoist policies that sound good but ignore negative externalities. The tragedy of the commons is inevitable is their view.
i hear what you’re saying.
what i’m saying is, for myself, and at least a few “Left-curious” neo/libs/progs, we don’t want to trade one shit tyranny for another. and it’s obvious, documented history of some pretty glaring failures in AES. if you like, think of ppl like us as trauma victims. it’s probably true anyway.
it can go a long way to offer the olive branch and reassurance that, yes, you don’t want to just “red-wash” that all away, or that you aren’t just enamoured with Red aesthetic and lip-service while being YET ANOTHER group of mastubatory elitists who will trample the out-group-du-jour given the opportunity.
Socialism allows for both public and private ownership, individual freedoms, and democratic decision-making, while still aiming for social equality. Communism, in contrast, tends to involve total state control and often limits personal freedoms.
Tell me you’ve never read anything about communism that wasn’t written by anti-communists without telling me you’ve never read anything about communism that wasn’t written by anti-communists.
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Jesus what a mess of a sentence. You really tried to hamfist that one in there.
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Well I will agree that your average 16 year-old is more well read then the person I replied to.
That doesn’t even make sense…
😘 be well
You should go back to Reddit, you’d be happier there
be better
All this things sound great, we just need humanity to not be shitty to each other.
Workers of the world unite!
Edit: not that I’m into that sort of thing… I’ve taken history classes, I’ve read about, I’ve watched documentaries, I understand that communism is not to be desired or
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Luigi’s hand doesn’t look anything like that. Someone fix this meme
You’re not going to overthrow fascism, white supremacy or capitalism with random acts of adventurism. If you’re not more organized than your enemy they will crush you.
I leave that to the plumber’s union.
i want memes, not politics
You’re on the wrong instance then. The lemmy.ml instance is very heavily political, even in political communities.
Found the capitalist!
find something better to do than name calling. besides dont capitalists own the factories or whatever? you dont even know what ur saying
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what does this have to do with this post
What does this have to do with Russia
I thought memes were supposed to be funny… this just looks like a propaganda poster
I mean, propaganda is technically a type of meme, isn’t it?
And lithobreaking is technically a form of deceleration, but I wouldn’t exactly call it a safe way to land a rocket.
who is the anti bad thing propaganda poster hurting?
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Thank god I’m not the only one.
Don’t got to political Memes then. Some of the worst propaganda slop there
Ah yes, get rid of extremism with different extremism. I think we’ve been there already. Spoiler: Didnt work.
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When did Meredith at Dunder Mifflin become a vampire?
Last year
Yeah communism isn’t any better so the both can fuck off
Greed is the evil.
is the evilit’s their driving force.
I agree, capitalism is just one way greed manifests itself. Greedy opportunists figure out how to exploit any system. The people douchevoting you are binary meme-brains who think you’re saying capitalism is the greatest thing since Betty White because you didn’t explicitly say the opposite.
Sad to say, but humans are the root of evil. Atrocities have been done in the name of all sorts of things, but it’s always humans carrying it out.
I don’t get why every Reddit alternative needs to be filled with these weird political ideas. Communism, Fascism and every other form of extremism only leads to misery.
I’m sure capitalism is flawed, but you can make it work better. Any of the Nordic countries works as a great example. And no they aren’t perfect but nothing ever will be.
Capitalism is a form of extremism
Reddit is state controlled media. You’re seeing weird ideas outside of it because you’re allowed to now
Communism is no more extreme than capitalism. They just stand in opposition of one another. The red scare is back I guess.
I would say we have seen both extremes and we like neither and some people think a third alternative is “killing everyone else” can we not?
What are you on about with “red scare”? You can simply look at the poor attempts made in the name of communism to see how well that idea succeeds in practice. Simple solutions to complex issues never work. Communism is an extreme ideology based on the oversimplification of complex like every other form of populism.
The bible is also a long book, does that make it believable to you?
