I personally do, he actually risked his life to release information about the government spying on people. And there are for sure more advanced ways now. Even your phone is listening.
Yes. Unequivocally.
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before the transition* or before they transitioned* (not sure which one you meant to write)
And before SHE went to prison, I see no reason to say he other than being a anti-trans shit stain. The timing of the transition doesn’t matter at all, a person who is transsexual should be called the gender they know they are independent on if someone is talking about before their public transition. A person is the gender they feel they are and should be called so for any time in their life unless they have specifically said that they want to be called their biological/sexual gender when others talk about them before their transition.
Transgender is the preferred term fyi.
Was going to write these exact words.
I consider him a true American patriot.
Nothing is more patriotic than wanting your country to do better.
Implementing drag net surveillance was a terrible decision, and exposing it was truly heroic.
Sadly, Snowden is now in the clutches of Russia who can and does use him as their pawn.
It is easy to say that this is where the EU should have stepped up and given him sanctuary, but that would have been less than ideal for him.
- Europe and the US have close ties with police and law enforcement, while no EU nation would hand their own citizens over to the US, they would absolutely hand over a US citizen to the US if requested.
- During the war on terror, Europe was complicit in plenty of illegal renditions of their own citizens to the CIA, they were then sent to illegal black sites and tortured, plenty of these persons have since been proven innocent.
Given the high profile of Snowden’s leak, the US still want’s him back, and back then even more so, had Snowden gone to the EU, he most likely would have been extradited, kidnapped or even assassinated.
By staying in Russia that was a far lower risk to him.
“The west should have protected him from the west.”
Eh, the EU makes a big deal of freedom, and has stood up to the US in the past, but here there are actual laws and regulations to follow, and if we stop extraditing US citizens to the US, the US would stop extraditing our citizens to us.
Countries in the EU are still occupying Africa. Settler shitheads.
It appears that I am out of the loop on this…
Here’s one example: https://www.pulse.ng/story/7-ways-france-still-controls-its-former-african-colonies-2024072617033075753
Don’t feel bad. Many are out of the loop. The west spends a lot of money ensuring most are clueless to what’s actually going on in the world.
That article made me vigorously expel air from my nose.
What’s the #1 way that France still controls its former African colonies?
“1. These countries must officially speak French”
Did you know England controls the United States? How? England makes the US speak English. I’m super serial! This isn’t a laughing matter, so stop laughing at this matter.
Oh, I had no idea about this…
The colonial tax seems especially evil.
Luckily it seems entirely fabricated like many other claims on that post in Pulse Nigeria’s Food and Travel section
Unironically true. Wish we lived in the timeline where war crimes mattered and those war criminal bastards were rotting in prison. Now because the USA let their own war crimes slide, it’s made autonomous killing systems permissible and civilian casualty rates nearly completely ignored as the horrible precedent of today and on. I hate warfare with a passion
He’s at lower risk from the US, but speaking out about Russia would probably be riskier. It’s an unfortunate situation for him to be stuck in Russia and not some other safe country.
I think the Swiss should have offered him assistance in an embassy or Vietnam or somewhere other than Putin’s Russia (which we knew was bad even back then).
Really though, Obama should have pardoned him.
while no EU nation would hand their own citizens over to the US
Europe was complicit in plenty of illegal renditions of their own citizens to the CIA
Make up your mind.
EU states have handed over their own citizens to the US, if these people have hurt us citizens enough. There is a nice episode of the darknet diaries that just came out
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Nothing is more patriotic than wanting your country to do better.
Is being patriotic and wanting your first world country to do better something heroic?
Well that highly depends in what you deem good. If wantig to do better is stopping the support of any goverment that suppresses its people and/or invades other countrys and you put your life in the line for that goal, i think thats very heroic.
I think he blew up his life to reveal something the general public probably should be aware of, but ultimately didn’t care about.
Idk if it was heroic, but it certainly was interesting how he released the info slowly to get catch the government in numerous lies attempting to downplay the truth of the matter. One of the Obama administration’s biggest blights.
the news quickly buried it and allowed propaganda to trash his name, usa surely dont want more shit to come out.
Guy gave up his life to show Americans (and the world) the truth, and we as a society just ignored him.
I’m starting to think the world isn’t even worth saving, since this is how the world treats those that want to save it.
Need to just let Dalamud fall already and embrace the next umbral era.
Man I’m too tired to deal with bahamut again. Can we just skip dalamud and go straight to having the first fall to the light entirely?
Only a few hundred billionaires. You can take a meaningful percentage of revenge if you’re just careful and get all your ideas 9f effectiveness from anime and ubisoft games.
ignored him.
No we hunted him and he had to hide in Russia.
it’s not so much we ignored him as the government ran a huge smear campaign to discredit him
Yes. You’re a bootlicker if you say otherwise
Exactly. I think FEDS are in here now. One dude was saying he isn’t a hero and a criminal, lol.
What’s the point of asking for opinions if this is what you think of opinions different than yours.
well the timeline we live in has pushed many to spaces where there is a common understanding of the nature of our state. Red flags and normie takes. We don’t all agree on everything but more than not. Welcome to the fedi. Welcome to the fringes. Or the shad ball of deplorables.
Confirmation
An opinion based on falsities is not really an opinion, like a favourite color, or food and such.
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Anonymous_Leaker == SBD - Silent but deadly 🤣
“What’s in a name? That which we call a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.”
A real name with a general location can do wonders.
A 2 day old account with that name immediately vague-threatening anyone who answers incorrectly to an opinion question?
The vibe is off
Nothing was threatening, that’s slander. Perhaps, it was misunderstood. I was just giving tips on what not to do. How about a fresh start?
People should own their own shame they create based on their ability to compehend their actions… It should motivate their change anything else is kinky. You should not accept shame like a nasty little gift. criminal, was ist das? well sheet I am a criminal too… who isn’t? Straight Thuggin
Lol, gang gang.
I would argue that praising soldiers for their bravery and calling them heroes is a bootlicker thing to do.
Yes, 100 percent. The fact that he’s in exile in Russia is because he cannot get a fair trial in the US. He was never a Russian asset, he’s a whistleblower being unfairly persecuted
If he was a russian asset he’d be president today
Or the head of intelligence
Everybody, who puts morals or ethics in front of their own, personal gain, is by default a hero in today’s context. That’s the only weapon we have against authoritarian regimes, capitalism and oligarchy. A weapon, that can only be used once per capita. But don’t be fooled—we are all.
He told the truth about the US spying on it’s citizens. I got nothing respect for him.
No he provided evidence. There were people around the globe who knew about the nsa before Edward Snowden and told the truth. There were articles and videos back in 2008 about the nsa backdoor into windows. The only main difference is he, “proved it.” like you know how someone goes, “yeah! well prove it!!!” He did.
There were people around the globe who knew about the nsa before Edward Snowden and told the truth.
There was a whole fucking Will Smith movie about it in the late 90s. With Gene Hackman, and young Jack Black and Seth Green. Enemy of the State.
But yeah that wasn’t proof, either. But it was the closest to people shouting on the rooftops that this kind of thing was, in fact, happening.
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Seeing how little we actually did, I often wonder if he regrets coming forward.
I don’t think you remember https before. Snowden’s revelations kicked off LetsEncrypt and the much broader deployment of https.
https://www.standwithsnowden.com/news/lets-encrypt-and-snowden.html
Yes, he’s a hero And he shouldn’t be punished for calling out the he found. Hope he’s having a great day
What Snowden did was objectively good, and he did so at great personal cost, but you should be cautious about making any living person your hero. His politics seem to lean closer to libertarian nut-job than anything else, and it’s very possible he will disappoint you in the future. Case in point, Glen Greenwald broke the Snowden leaks, and I considered him one of my heros for a time,.but these days he sounds more like Tucker Carlson than anyone else. The point is, admire heroic actions, but don’t make people your heroes.
His politics seem to lean closer to libertarian nut-job than anything else
Sure, but you could say the same of Luigi Mangione and that isn’t slowing anyone down.
Case in point, Glen Greenwald broke the Snowden leaks, and I considered him one of my heros for a time,.but these days he sounds more like Tucker Carlson than anyone else.
Glenn was always a libertarian crank. But after he got ousted from The Guardian, his economic needs superseded his politics. I might suggest that if Glenn had ended up on MSNBC rather than the gutter for FOX News washouts, he’d be denouncing Snowden today rather than praising him.
The point is, admire heroic actions, but don’t make people your heroes.
I don’t think you can criticize Snowden because the guy who interviewed him ended up becoming a crank. But I also don’t know of what became of Snowden, outside “he fled to Russia after Hong Kong wouldn’t hide him”.
I might suggest that Snowden was only able to leak what he did because he climbed up the ranks through Booze-Allen to begin with. And there you’ve got an inherent problem with whistleblowers - either coming or going, they must have done something you don’t like.
But I’d say his turn of conscious and his work ethic and professionalism in how the information was aggregated, leaked, and confirmed makes him a role model for anyone else who aspires to turn coat against a fascist regime. Whatever you think of the individuals, you still do need Role Models in order to inform how you might achieve similar results. That means studying other people - studying history at the individualist level - and asking how they did what they did. Ideally, you’re studying people you admire because you want to be more like them. Realistically, you’re going to study people and see their warts. And that might shape what you think about their motivations and whether your own motivations lead you the same way.
Sure, but you could say the same of Luigi Mangione and that isn’t slowing anyone down.
I mean, I would say you shouldn’t make him your hero either. Even if you think what he did was heroic, lone gunman assassins usually don’t turn out to be very stable, well adjusted people. Hell, Ted Kacynski has some good points about post-Industrial life, but that doesn’t mean he should be your hero.
I might suggest that if Glenn had ended up on MSNBC rather than the gutter for FOX News washouts, he’d be denouncing Snowden today rather than praising him.
Very possible, and nearly as disappointing. My point isn’t that he changed or became worse, just that I projected more of my ideals onto him than he actually shared.
I don’t think you can criticize Snowden because the guy who interviewed him ended up becoming a crank.
To be clear, I’m not. I’m saying that he has some views and beliefs that may lead him to disappoint you in the future. He mostly doesn’t comment much on politics outside of the surveillance state, but he has described himself as a libertarian, and said that he believes social security is a scam that needs to die. It seems clear that he is anti-authoritarian, but it’s very possible that, if he ever became more vocal about American politics, you’d learn a lot about him that would disappoint you.
Yes, and I wish him well. Be careful, if you’re thinking of anything.
It’s hard to say he’s a hero, but, what he did was undoubtedly heroic.
If doing something heroic does not make you a hero then what does?
I would say inspiring people. Not that anyone should be held to that standard, mind you; I don’t begrudge Edward for fucking off to Russia. One heroic deed is certainly more than most, and I think the world would be a better place if more people rose to the occasion. But to call him a hero? Idk. I personally wouldn’t.
Can you give an example of someone you would call a hero?
I’d say a well known example is Greta Thunberg. She’s consistently stood up for good things at the cost of her health and safety, and while (no offense) nothing has been at the level of exposing a global surveillance apparatus, she has consistently engaged with the world, rolling each action into her public persona, only to use that persona to garner even more attention to her next action. I know Snowden clearly performed an extraordinary act at the cost of his own health and safety; truly a heroic action. And again, I mean this as no slight, dude did more than most; dude is well within his rights to go live as he wants. But, while I would say that Snowden has a consistency to his message, I wouldn’t necessarily say he has consistency to his action.
You think him fleeing to Russia is inconsistent? It seems to me that the organizations he’s exposed are the sort of outfits that would murder someone like him, so in order to stay alive I don’t know what other choices he would’ve had.
Agree on Greta btw, but to continue with the same example, I would say that killing a little girl is less likely, because it would create a martyr. And if she were ever in danger I wouldn’t hold it against her if she chose to disappear somewhere. She’s already done more than enough.
My point being, I don’t necessarily see the difference, and I’m a bit confused at the apparent hesitation to label Snowden a hero. Tempted to assume that the smear campaign is working even in these circles.
Bro if you’re just looking to pick a fight, I’m not engaging
I’m genuinely asking wtf?
Nope. You can do a great deed and still be a shitty person.
Are you saying Snowden is a shitty person? If so, why, what’s he done?
He’s not. Unless you think taking a job to protect your country is “shitty”
I’m not saying anything. The thread is about Snowden and you said one can do great things and still be a shitty person, so I’m trying to understand what you mean.
No, I didn’t.
Nope. That goes for everyone.
Finally we had a guy truthfully hollering that the sky was falling and, at the end of the day, no-one gave a shit.
Wtf are you talking about. Mass roll outs of encryption only came thanks to him
You’re both correct. There was a lot of changes after him thanks to him. But majority of people still don’t give a shit.
That is good if true, but mass spying still happens and is practically accepted as normal part lf our lives. In fact it’s only getting more invasive by the day.
I don’t think most people accept it exactly, they just don’t see any option to confront it, and are struggling with their material needs while being inundated with propaganda from every possible avenue, so it’s hard to be certain enough of anything to take action. Most people are afraid to fight against a system that could black bag them and drop them in the ocean if they wanted to. We have been told that we are under a complete panopticon and serious rebellion against it even if they don’t arrest you can cost your job, which usually means healthcare and stable housing for people in the US. The state and the rich firmly have their boot on our face.
Online dragnet surveillance does happen. And, thanks to the Snowden revelations, we all now have tools to protect ourselves from it.
Using https on Facebook and using Signal for daily messages to your Mom are practically accepted as normal part of our lives.
There are a lot of comments here saying “it’s tragic because no-one cared”, but that is misleading as there is now a strong privacy movement.
I think, without Snowden blowing the whistle, anti-privacy laws would not face such stiff competition.
Yes we’re all fighting a rearguard retreat, but without Snowden’s sacrifice there would be no rearguard and there would be abject surrender rather than retreat, and we’d all live under eastern-style surveillance states without ever knowing.
I think, without Snowden blowing the whistle, anti-privacy laws would not face such stiff competition.
You think there’s much opposition to laws and decisions that erode privacy? In the US in particular privacy has been eroding at an increasing rate year after year.
That’s exactly what the comment you’re responding to is saying, with the additional observation that there would be even less resistance without the Snowden leaks.
And what I’m saying is that there isn’t any evidence that the Snowden leaks resulted in people caring about their privacy.
I am an American who cares about privacy largely because of Snowden. His book was very eye opening, and a great read. So that’s at least 1 person
Where you fighting that fight because everybody who seems to care is also removing themselves from all social media. They keep saying they’re doing things locally like …
Meeting in coffee shops?
Like weirdly I’ve had this phrase said to me multiple times and it’s so silly. Hold on guys I’m going to release a new movie I spent years making. I refuse to use the space with millions of people cause I don’t like who created it. I’m going to stand around Starbucks and tell people about it. Find me 40 years to build up a cult following
