Mannerheim, oh lord. The White Butcher, the very same who bombed the ice road to Leningrad and (unverified) put up our own concentration camps? You really do fly your colours high don’t you? The colors of Suur-Suomi, the one with the swastikas and only a blonde, blue-eyed population. No roma or karelians here! Disgusting.
The bombing of the ice-road seems to be a misconception of mine, though I personally wouldn’t put it outside the realm of possibilities. Most contemporary Finns really don’t really like engaging with their own history critically.
On the concentration camps in Karelia though one can find multiple sources, like this, or this one that delves deeper into Finland’s past, also discussing Finnish treatment of Jews during the war.
On the issue of The White Butcher (ie. the deeds of the White Finns and Mannerheim against the Reds in the Civil War in 1918): many of the sources I found were in Finnish, but some can be found in English. Such as this, this. The whites tended to “shoot on sight”, under Mannerheim’s decree, with the local church unsurprisingly playing tow to anti-communist messaging.
Seems to be a skill-issue, huh? Do you have any sources on your claims of human waves? I’m willing to take a gander
Just wikipedia huh. You mentioned American, Ukrainian and Russian sources regarding human waves in the current war in Ukraine, but I guess those don’t exist, then?
Oh yeah, look at that… “White House reports”, “According to Ukrainian officials”… forgive me, but I’m kinda suspicious of these sources. One claims to be Bloomberg but redirects to Washington Post’s or whatever homepage with no article in sight. The one Russian milblogger that I found through there seemed to use the term in complaining about inadequate air support and artillery coverage during assaults, which is probably true as drone warfare mixed things up a lot. The other claims of inadequate leadership also probably stand.
The fact that during WWII the whole concept of the Soviets using human wave attacks was cope and propaganda by the Nazis (especially Goebbels) to explain how their glorious aryan soldiers armed with their glorious Wunderwaffen could lose so spectacularly to the untermensch. This was taken further by the US who employed Nazi generals and their memoirs to shape the narrative in the Cold War world. Here’s a source, many others can be found. Was there a kernel of truth in this? Yes, the Red Army wasn’t that well organized when the invasion began, and employed many poorly organized battalions of mostly peasant backgrounds. Add to this the purges in the upper echelons of the Army (done to prevent counter-revolution by fifth columnists) led to many losses.
I hope you can start to see why some of your claims got the reaction they got. People (liberals and openly fascist alike) who come around here usually only have the same few talking points, and people around here are understandably completely fed up with them.
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Mannerheim, oh lord. The White Butcher, the very same who
bombed the ice road to Leningrad and(unverified) put up our own concentration camps? You really do fly your colours high don’t you? The colors of Suur-Suomi, the one with the swastikas and only a blonde, blue-eyed population. No roma or karelians here! Disgusting.Wow. That’s some stuff I’ve never heard of before. Care to share any sources? I couldn’t find anything as juicy as that searching the web.
The bombing of the ice-road seems to be a misconception of mine, though I personally wouldn’t put it outside the realm of possibilities. Most contemporary Finns really don’t really like engaging with their own history critically.
On the concentration camps in Karelia though one can find multiple sources, like this, or this one that delves deeper into Finland’s past, also discussing Finnish treatment of Jews during the war.
On the issue of The White Butcher (ie. the deeds of the White Finns and Mannerheim against the Reds in the Civil War in 1918): many of the sources I found were in Finnish, but some can be found in English. Such as this, this. The whites tended to “shoot on sight”, under Mannerheim’s decree, with the local church unsurprisingly playing tow to anti-communist messaging.
Seems to be a skill-issue, huh? Do you have any sources on your claims of human waves? I’m willing to take a gander
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Just wikipedia huh. You mentioned American, Ukrainian and Russian sources regarding human waves in the current war in Ukraine, but I guess those don’t exist, then?
They’re all in there, I promise.
Edit: for the downvoters:
American
Ukrainian
Russian 1 2 3 4 (via this link)
All found in the Wikipedia article, under the header “Use” - “Russian invasion of Ukraine” - “Russian military”.
Edit 2: the first American source (washington post) seems to suffer from link rot. Here’s another source.
Oh yeah, look at that… “White House reports”, “According to Ukrainian officials”… forgive me, but I’m kinda suspicious of these sources. One claims to be Bloomberg but redirects to Washington Post’s or whatever homepage with no article in sight. The one Russian milblogger that I found through there seemed to use the term in complaining about inadequate air support and artillery coverage during assaults, which is probably true as drone warfare mixed things up a lot. The other claims of inadequate leadership also probably stand.
The fact that during WWII the whole concept of the Soviets using human wave attacks was cope and propaganda by the Nazis (especially Goebbels) to explain how their glorious aryan soldiers armed with their glorious Wunderwaffen could lose so spectacularly to the untermensch. This was taken further by the US who employed Nazi generals and their memoirs to shape the narrative in the Cold War world. Here’s a source, many others can be found. Was there a kernel of truth in this? Yes, the Red Army wasn’t that well organized when the invasion began, and employed many poorly organized battalions of mostly peasant backgrounds. Add to this the purges in the upper echelons of the Army (done to prevent counter-revolution by fifth columnists) led to many losses.
I hope you can start to see why some of your claims got the reaction they got. People (liberals and openly fascist alike) who come around here usually only have the same few talking points, and people around here are understandably completely fed up with them.
The link seems not to work
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