• azimir@lemmy.ml
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    1 day ago

    I presume it’s the same kind of deal Stalin and Hitler forged about Poland.

    • plyth@feddit.org
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      1 day ago

      So why would Putin sign it if he knows that the US will keep pushing to break up Russia?

      • ms.lane@lemmy.world
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        1 day ago

        It’s interesting to see the divergence of people eating Russian propaganda to the MAGA propaganda.

        But I’ll bite for a second - when has any US official spoken about breaking up Russia? (Not USSR)

        • plyth@feddit.org
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          1 day ago

          A National Security Advisor wrote this:

          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Grand_Chessboard

          But it is not so important what they write but what they do. The US wage illegal wars and military operations and do regime changes for resources, like Iraq, Venezuela, Argentina. Russia is an inevitable target with its resources.

          Putin has offered cooperation until 2001 and beyond, but the West has stalled. Why would anybody do that and avoid world peace if not for hostile reasons?

          • Lucius_Sweet@lemmy.world
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            1 day ago

            The west has been cooperating with Putin since he first got into power 25 years ago and was sending over 150 billion dollars a year Russia’s way for those resources. Do you put as much foreign policy weight into Medvedev’s recent threats to nuke the UK as you do some dude who was Jimmy Carters national security adviser 50 years ago in his book published 30 years ago.

            You are eating up Putin’s anti west “The west are trying to steal Russia’s resources, it’s certainly not me and the rest of the Russian oligarchs doing it right under your noses” propaganda.

            The only one avoiding peace is Putin who invaded Ukraine remember?

            • plyth@feddit.org
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              1 day ago

              sending over 150 billion dollars a year Russia’s way for those resources.

              That’s just market value and not a form of support. It’s more an argument for why the West has a motive to take over Russia than it is an argument against it.

              Do you put as much foreign policy weight into Medvedev’s recent threats

              That’s apples to oranges. One is the overall strategy and the other is the last option. Without the Western threat there would be no need for nukes. It all starts with US resource wars. The rest is consequences.

              You are eating up Putin’s anti west “The west are trying to steal Russia’s resources, … propaganda

              Calling it propaganda doesn’t make it wrong. Is the West not stealing resources globally? Why would Russia be spared?

              The only one avoiding peace is Putin who invaded Ukraine remember?

              Which would put Russia at the receiving end of a hybrid war until it is dissolved.

              • Lucius_Sweet@lemmy.world
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                22 hours ago

                That’s just market value and not a form of support.

                Why would the EU be sending 150 billion as a form of support, why do you feel entitled to free money? Russia was selling the EU resources and became rich enough over the last decade to start a war with Ukraine and have enough money in the bank to ride out the first 4 years of sanctions.

                One is the overall strategy and the other is the last option. Without the Western threat there would be no need for nukes. It all starts with US resource wars. The rest is consequences.

                No it is not the overall strategy, just the opinion of one dude who served in government 50 years ago. Medvedev is a current member of Russia’s ruling party. The fact that Russia has nukes means they have no reason to fear invasion because of mutually assured destruction. No one is planning on invading Russia. Russia is the one currently waging a resource war against Ukraine as well as stealing gold and diamonds while providing protection to African warlords. Russia is currently doing what you claim the west is planning on doing to Russia.

                Which would put Russia at the receiving end of a hybrid war until it is dissolved.

                The only ones coveting a piece of Russia are the 100 million Chinese on the border of Russian Manchuria. The Chinese leadership does not forget the last of the unequal treaties. This will be Chinese land again soon.

                • plyth@feddit.org
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                  20 hours ago

                  Why would the EU be sending 150 billion as a form of support

                  The west has been cooperating with Putin since he first got into power 25 years ago and was sending over 150 billion dollars a year Russia’s way

                  That sounded like they were supporting Russia, not just doing business.

                  Russia was selling the EU resources and became rich enough

                  As did Germany and the EU from using the gas which allows them to finance the war for Ukraine. Usually the processing companies make the bigger profits.

                  just the opinion of one dude

                  Who is highly decorated. There are the notes from chancellor Kohl that at least Germany had no intention of including Russia despite telling Russia something else. If the West wouldn’t think like that dude we would have behaved differently.

                  as well as stealing gold and diamonds while providing protection to African warlords.

                  For the most part Russia works for the elected governments, unlike the West. In which country are they stealing?

                  The fact that Russia has nukes means they have no reason to fear invasion because of mutually assured destruction.

                  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceX_Starshield

                  We are starting to continue where the disarmament interrupted the arms race.

                  The Chinese leadership does not forget the last of the unequal treaties.

                  Neither will they forget the opium wars and the eight nation alliance. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eight-Nation_Alliance

                  As long as the US is not willing to let China become the hegemon once they have the better technology, Russia and China will be best friends.

                  If you look at how poor and sick people live in the US, isn’t becoming part of the US empire the bigger threat?

          • Taldan@lemmy.world
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            22 hours ago

            You should come back to reality so we can understand what you’re saying

            • plyth@feddit.org
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              21 hours ago

              What’s there not to understand? The link shows that there are people thinking about how to break up Russia and if you look at American foreign politics it’s clear that countries cannot rely on the US not attacking them.

              • Taldan@lemmy.world
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                16 hours ago

                The fact you think the US would invade Russia for natural resources is inconsistent with reality

                If the US had any desire to invade, they would have done so in 1991

                They didn’t because of many reasons, but the simplest to understand is: nukes

                You’re trying to argue natural resources would drive the US to do so, but that’s entirely irrational. If the US were is invade any major country for natural resources, it would be Canada. They have far more than Russia, with much less of a military, and no nukes

                There is no situation where the US would attack Russia for natural resources. It’s not in their interest, even ignoring negative externalities from other countries

                • plyth@feddit.org
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                  10 hours ago

                  The fact you think the US would invade Russia for natural resources is inconsistent with reality

                  The US wage illegal wars and military operations and do regime changes for resources, like Iraq, Venezuela, Argentina.

                  The US financed NGOs. It looks like bringing freedom until one remembers the homeless and uninsured in the US. Yeltsin was supported against the Communists. The US almost were im control.

                  There is still an invasion looming because how else can the US contain China? That makes Nato rockets in Ukraine tricky.

                  but the simplest to understand is: nukes

                  Which is changing with SpaceX Starshield.

                  If the US were is invade any major country for natural resources, it would be Canada.

                  Canada is part of the Western sphere. No need to invade. They can get controlling stocks in companies. Many international mining companies are based in Canada.

                  There is no situation where the US would attack Russia for natural resources.

                  Not a direct attack but the North Stream pipeline explosion allows the US to sell expensive fracking gas to the EU.

                  The US don’t fight for the resources but for the influence. They don’t need the oil in the middle east for themselves.

                  They need them for sanctions, like the ones against Iran and Cuba. China cannot be isolated if they have access to Russian resources.