• Ulrich@feddit.org
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      2 months ago

      Okay but it’s specifically software from outside the Play Store?

      • grue@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        The point is, there shouldn’t be a distinction. To make one is to support prejudice against installing software from elsewhere.

        If you use “installing” for stuff from the Google store but any other word for stuff from other sources, you are aiding and abetting Google’s anti-property-rights propaganda.

        • Ulrich@feddit.org
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          2 months ago

          there shouldn’t be a distinction.

          There has to be. When 99% of installs come from one location, there needs to be a way to describe that other than “Installing apps from outside the default app store”.

          To make one is to support prejudice against installing software from elsewhere.

          No? It isn’t.

          • Vespair@lemmy.zip
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            2 months ago

            The majority of PC game sales happen via steam but we don’t call games purchased from GOG “sideloaded.”

            There is no necessary reason to make the distinction

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              There is no necessary reason to make the distinction

              There is and I’ve already given it. MS app store doesn’t make up 99% of installations.

              • yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca
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                2 months ago

                Okay, I understand your position. Android’s play store has market dominance, so the a term to distinguish between 99% of play store installs vs others, makes sense.

                Now, that is a tangent to the main issue, just arguing semantics. The issue is control versus openness, not about the term sideloading.

                Is Google’s plan to restrict app sideloading a good thing in your eyes, or no?

                • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                  2 months ago

                  Now, that is a tangent to the main issue

                  A tangent someone else made. Many others really.

                  just arguing semantics

                  100%

                  Is Google’s plan to restrict app sideloading a good thing in your eyes, or no?

                  Absolutely not. I will no longer recommend Android to anyone. It’s cooked, as far as I’m concerned.

                  • yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca
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                    2 months ago

                    Nice, I could tell you’re a smart dude, so at least we all can agree that Android is no longer to be trusted.

                    Funny how words and language become the focus of this thread, and then the main issues get pushed to the side. I was arguing against you as if we didn’t agree on the main problem 😅

          • yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            The words for distinguishing between apps that come from one trusted location vs others is usually untrusted or unverified apps versus trusted or verified ones. “Installing apps from outside the default app store” converts to, “Installing an untrusted app”.

            It’s not that complicated.

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              “Installing apps from outside the default app store” converts to, “Installing an untrusted app”.

              It doesn’t. It’s not that complicated.

      • BootLoop@sh.itjust.works
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        2 months ago

        The same word that I use to when I get software that’s not on the Microsoft Store, the Mac App Store, or whatever distro’s Software GUI when I am using my desktop…

        • Ulrich@feddit.org
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          2 months ago

          If the MS Store and Mac App store made up 99% of installs, that might make sense.

          • ideonek@piefed.social
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            2 months ago

            Why? That’s a perfect example. There is no qualitative difrence between Microsoft Store and Play Store. Why quantitative difference in the market share would make any distinction in the terminology we use around the process?

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              I’ve already explained why. I don’t know what more there is to say. If you don’t get it, that’s okay.

          • BootLoop@sh.itjust.works
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            2 months ago

            So when I install an app from Fdroid, it’s only “installing” if lots of other people do it? But if other people don’t use it as much it’s “sideloading”?

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              “lots of other people” was not the words I used.

              It can be both “installing” and “sideloading”. One is just more specific.

      • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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        2 months ago

        When I install software from the Arch User Repository I still just call it installing, even though it isn’t through the standard path. Everywhere else, you don’t make the distinction. For some reason on phones we’ve come to call it sideloading, even though the software is just software —it doesn’t care where it came from.

          • yardratianSoma@lemmy.ca
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            2 months ago

            even within android, if you attempt to install an apk directly, it doesn’t say “would you like to sideload this application?”, but instead says, “Do you want to install this app?”.

            Even Google’s own OS doesn’t use made up language.

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              I don’t know what that’s supposed to prove. Use of the word is not mandatory.

          • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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            2 months ago

            Again, when I install something from the AUR (which is not where most software comes from —99+% are from official repositories) it isn’t given a special term. It’s the exact same situation as “sideloading” but we just call it installing. Can you explain what the difference is between them?

            • Ulrich@feddit.org
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              2 months ago

              —99+% are from official repositories

              LOL you just lumped every other repository into one and then excepted the AUR for…reasons?

              • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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                2 months ago

                Because the AUR is by users. The others aren’t.

                I know you just can’t explain the difference though so wrote this instead.

                • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                  2 months ago

                  I don’t understand what that has to do with this conversation?

                  • Cethin@lemmy.zip
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                    2 months ago

                    Wow, you’re frustrating. If using an unofficial source for applications is called sideloading, why isn’t that term used for desktop computing? The term only exists for phones. The AUR is an unofficial user-run source and is equivalent to a source other than the play/apple store. If that term was actually useful or needed we call installing applications from the AUR sideloading, but we don’t. Clearly the term has no real utility besides making it sound like something you shouldn’t do.

      • youmaynotknow@lemmy.zip
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        2 months ago

        When you install a ‘.exe’ file in Windows, you don’t call it ‘sideloading’, you call it ‘downloading and installing’.

        This is the exact same thing. I download from sites, F-Droid, Obtainium, etc., and install the software that is the file I downloaded. I’m effectively NOT side-anything.

      • track_stick_baboon@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        Installing software from outside the play store should be called installing software. It’s installing software from the play store what should have a special name, like “gatedloading” for example.

        • Ulrich@feddit.org
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          2 months ago

          Installing software from outside the play store should be called installing software

          Good news. It is!

          It’s installing software from the play store what should have a special name, like “gatedloading” for example.

          Make it hap’n Cap’n. You’re still not invalidating the term of “sideloading”.

      • Wrrzag@lemmy.ml
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        2 months ago

        If you need to be that specific, “installing” as in “installing software from outside the play store”

        • Ulrich@feddit.org
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          2 months ago

          We have words for things for a reason. We don’t call doctors “guys who heal people”.

          • Wrrzag@lemmy.ml
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            2 months ago

            Yet we call people who hold a doctorate “doctors”, and if we need to specify we use terms like “medical doctors” or “doctors in philosophy”.

      • Grazed@lemmy.world
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        2 months ago

        In what way is installing from the play store fundamentally different? Just because it was preloaded on your phone? What if F droid was preloaded on your phone instead? Is it still sideloading? Google’s logic breaks down pretty quickly when you think about it

        • Ulrich@feddit.org
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          2 months ago

          Yes, so what do you call it when referring specifically to those apps?