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Ai is bad is such an intellectually lazy take. Anyone who understands Data Science and Calculus well enough to understand how LLM’s work are going to be able to get better results than everyone else. Everyone else, well, they are grasping at straws and inventing fictions…Seriously go study data science and experience statistics before you make claims that don’t hold up to scrutiny.
I don’t understand what’s he talking about. I was forced to use AI by my employer and instantly lost all the joy in programming.
Have it do the tedious work
Have it create a better testing environment
Have it do bunch of edge case things or automate ui testing.
Use it as a tool. You can still be the brains.
I’m doing all that, but it’s not the same. I’m no longer writing code and it was my favorite part of the job. I guess I was lucky to have a job I enjoyed, now I join the 87% of people who hate their job.
That’s your managers fault then not ai itself if you can’t use it how you want to
a great way to find joy in programming
I already had that, thanks Linus. Did you not?
And then yesterday he said something along the lines of “we need to make it harder to contribute to the Linux kernel.” Which I believe he means to say “oh god there’s so much being submitted all of a sudden and it’s all slop.”
The people who are keeping up with this controversy and end up with this conclusion are wildely illiterate, or, extremely biased and making up fictions.
"Well, well, well if it isn’t the consequences of my own actions. "
- Linus Probably
Hey, I’d only be killing people objectively bad for humanity. Trump and his allies, Putin, my ex-wife, Saudi Arabia’s crown Prince, Netanyahu, that guy who cut me off in traffic last month, Rupert Murdoch, the Ellison family…
y’know this actually made me think of a good plot for a short spinoff:
Hardcore christian person finds the death note, spends some time researching who the most evil people are, then follows a year of writing one name every day after which they go through a ritual and prayers and then repeat the next day, and at the end they finish by writing their own name because they know humans can’t be trusted with that power and consider themselves to have simply been the hand of god and now it’s time to face His judgement.
Basically just literally Silas (the white haired dude) in the Da Vinci Code.
Torvalds is doing an illicit substitution of Claude, Gemini, Copilot et al. for the vague term AI, which also includes local models, open-weight models and things that aren’t LLM (machine translations, for example), thus ignoring the ethical issues associated with the operation of commercial AI/LLM services.
Most tokens sold come from China today and open weight models, and
most(EDIT) 42% of energy produced in China is from clean sources like nuclear or renewables. Don’t blame AI for ethics or lack thereof in neoliberal capitalism and a lack of planning or regulations. China also has the most and smartest regulations on AI so far.Does Linux Torvalds use those Chinese and open weight models? Iirc he was using Claude
The point is that fuckai aims to outright villanize people who use AI, although in a proper democratic society we would have massively invested in nuclear and renewables.
The principles would be “If a material good or service can be produced ethically but is only not produced ethically due to profit maximizing which the individual has no power over, then the individual is not ethically responsible for using or boycotting it”.
Or said simpler, the whole fuckai demagoguery is misdirecting anger that should go towards capitalism and especially neoliberal capitalism against people just trying to exist in the fucking system.
i came to this forum thinking i’d find interesting stuff and it’s mostly just people getting angry at reality
When reality is shit one must rage at it.
Rage is uncontrolled anger… it’s not helping anyone and certainly not the person experiencing it. If you can find a way to channel that anger into something constructive, then you are doing something beneficial for all
Yeah, but if that’s all you do nobody wants to be around you.
Oh no, you are one of those “if you don’t adapt you will be left behind” people, aren’t you?
low dimensional thinking
Yea I’m sure when Google came out “Real Programmers” were angry at all these people just looking up solutions to their coding issues, and using Stack Overflow instead of studying the API or books.
Only to be replaced by people that embraced the new technology.
im old enough to know this is exactly what happened
That’s how I felt when I found MDMA, and it allowed me to find joy in parties and being around people. If used responsibly, of course.
I’m getting exactly the same feeling with AI now. It is instant dopamine fun, but I can see it being addicting in exactly the same way. Of course I tell myself I’ll use it responsibly, for work, and keep my skills sharp by making sure to do some of my own projects, and be responsible in properly reviewing and checking my code.
Just as I told myself that I’ll keep a healthy pause of two months between mdma use, and have a rogorous vitamine and supplements plans based on the most recommended harm reduction research.
Sure, I did manage to do that for the first half a year or so, you can guess how it is now.
It’s pretty unsettling how exactly the same it feels, the way you slowly start giving up on things you’ve sworn to do, and how you slowly start to be unable to do/enjoy the thing (be it parties or coding) without it.
Suddenly Lemmy is going to explain to me why AI is the best thing ever.
Nah im still firmly anti AI regardless of what daddy says. Still based, but hypnotized by the tokens.
I agree, but the question is, how to use responsibly. I like to use it as an assistant that can look things up. Googling has the tendency to bring up outdated information, a good AI model is able to cross-reference what it finds with documentation and release notes. I never let the AI write anything for me though.
This is exactly how I use it too. Google and other search engines have gone to complete shit in order to cater to LLMs. So that’s how I use the LLM. You are my search bitch, Gemini. No, you’re not allowed to actually create anything.
They went to shit long before LLMs, they went to shit for SEO and algorithmic capitalism.
So how do they gatekeep the vibecoders out then? FOSS need to change and develop new quality control systems. Stop complaining about vibecode, just review it before you use it. Why can’t you do it?
rationing:
Limit lines of code or diff size. Limit scope. Limit PR per user per month. No bots, obviously. New users don’t get to send anything, they can comment and vote, at best. And bring in negative ratings for contributors: low quality, suspicious code, bad PRs.
This is another way of saying deceleration, a word that accelerationists hate.
Because the pace of code production has officially overwhelmed the human capacity to review it. As it was discussed recently. Linus answer was to use more AI, with the implementation of code review tools that gobble up code and spew out summaries.
For the time being, humans reading the summaries count as human reviewed. But at some point in time this system will crack. The current zeitgeist is to restrict who can contribute. Which leads to the obvious follow up question of who decides based on what, and how to decide who deserves to contribute.
You just witnessed the first steps into the philosophical and political erosion of the open source movement. Not just on the kernel but it is also affecting almost all popular FOSS projects.
But of course, that doesnt matter because Linux is not and has never been political. /s
Stop complaining about vibecode, just review it
Hahaha. Not a developer, huh?
There is no way I could possibly review my coworkers’ 1000s of lines of code he posts daily. I just blindly approve it because fuggggit we don’t care about quality only velocity.
This is different from before because before he would normally post 2 or 3 small code changes per week. Also, he would have tested it himself so starting off it would already be in a good state. Also, since he tested himself, we could talk about the change since he still had the context.
Now it’s just ship, ship, ship. We literally can’t “review it” like we did before. That world is gone.
So what happens when AI can recode on demand… Rather than programming a game, a gaming AI just generates the game as you play it.
Rather than writing a program, it just codes and runs the code at the same time… so that what you need is there when you request it to be.
Code chunks being put together and pulled apart as required. What then?
so what happens when i start barfing up gold coins and never can’t afford food again, what then?
There’ll be no gold coins, or individual programs anymore. Programming will be extinct.
i mean they’ve already shown that you can just straight up have an image model generate the game in real-time without even writing code
the future is the reverse matrix: all-but-sapient computers forced to dream our games
I miss when computers were fancy rocks we tricked into doing maths…There are things that we don’t know about yet that are too complicated to code by hand, and whey the models are good we will discover their limits then and start working on those
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…Verily?
Linus Torvalds is correct.
