I can’t say I’ve been using Lemmy for long, but from the get-go it seems that the communities, memes, opinions that get upvoted seem to reflect left-wing ideas.
I’m certainly not complaining, it honestly feels like a breathe of fresh air compared to other social media sites that seem to shift further and further to the far right, though I am curious to hear why this might be the case? Does FOSS tend to attract more left-wing minded people, or does this just happen to be a broadly left-wing microcosm/bubble?
Hope you all have a great day.
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Probably the open source nature of Lemmy but also…
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Are you an American? Based on US politics, much of the world would be “left wing” when much of it is really largely just moderates. Politics have been pushed so far to the right in the US that most politicians range from far right to moderate right, democrats included. Despite all the noise far right people are making about “the left”, there’s almost no far left representation in US government at all. Many of the people they’re talking about are just moderates and fellow conservatives that aren’t right wing enough in their view.
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I mean you signed up on lemmy.marxism-leninism. Yeah they tend to lean left, lol.
But yeah your observation indeed is is correct. Not only does lemmy lean left it often leans pretty far left too. It might feel like a breathe of fresh air but it’s still a bubble and echo chamber. It’s the same as truth social but the exact opposite. Nothing wrong with that per-se but it’s a good thing to keep in mind. Factual information is regularly downvoted here not because it’s false but because it doesn’t fit the narrative.
I don’t come here for the far left. I come here for the lack of the far right. The far left are some crazy nutters, too, but I think for the most part they are well meaning and that’s a damn sight better than the far right who just wear hatred on their fucking sleeves.
It means I get some shit for not wanting to live in a big city or being happy driving a car, but I take solace in the fact that I’ll be long dead before far left ideals take hold in any significant way. Meanwhile… fascism is a far more immediate threat, and that’s the one group of fuckers I give myself leave to unabashedly hate.
There’s no scarcity of hate on Lemmy either. It simply flies under the radar for most part because it’s directed at things we hate too. Exactly as is the case on far-right forums as well. Just read the comments of any thread about Elon, Police, Ai, Facebook, Twitter, Capitalism, Israel and so on. You even admit participating in it yourself.
The far-right thinks of themselves as well meaning just as well. Nobody thinks of themselves as the bad guys. Claiming they intend to be hateful and evil is disingenuine. That’s only how you view them. Their view of us is hardly any different. Both views are wrong.
If you think hating on fascists is just more of the same (and to be clear, there is a lot of ambiguity in what you said) then I’m going to have to disagree. There is no nobility in loving your enemy until they exterminate you.
As for the rest, you come at me a bit argumentative, but I don’t really disagree. But does it make it an echo chamber if I don’t fight everyone I disagree with? I’ve been arguing on the internet since before the WWW existed and nothing has changed, least of all anyone’s minds. I get upvotes when I manage a particularly eloquent turn of phrase that captures the zeitgeist, but as gratifying as that is I enjoy the back and fourth a lot more. I’d rather have someone thoughtfully and respectfully disagree with me.
No, I don’t think hating on fascists is the same but that assumes we’re speaking of actual fascists instead of more or less normal people who happen to lean right and get called fascists because it’s an easy label to throw at someone because we don’t like them and they’re making noises that remotely sound like something a fascist would make. It’s equivalent to the right calling someone a communist for advocating for things like UBI or higher taxes for the wealthy.
People like Elon Musk gets called a nazi here daily. I don’t care how much one hates him, that’s just a blatantly false accusation but it gets the upvotes because what they’re essentially saying is “boo Elon” and that’s something most Lemmings agree with. This just dillutes the meaning of these labels to the point that people then are sceptical even when they’re used appropriately.
It’s not about loving your enemy. Atleast not in my case. I’m only trying to remind people that groups consist of individuals and no two of them are the same. I don’t like how both sides so dishonestly represent eachother’s views on social media and use these extreme labels so lightly. I think in most things in life the truth is somwehere in the middle so wether it be left or right, the further one goes in that direction the more likely they’re to be at the wrong side of history. I’ll much rather trust the judgement of someone who whose beliefs are such a mixed bag that they’re near impossible to place on the political spectrum.
I’m also just rambling here now. I don’t even remember what we were talking about anymore.
I was trying to make clear I was talking about the far right. The folks who think the Proud Boys include some good people.
I’m not really sure about your Musk talking point though. For someone who definitely isn’t a Nazi, he sure does a lot for them. But, to argue with myself, he’s likely too drugged out and too much of a narcissist to have an ethos. Fucking nihilists.
I’d be fine with hating fascists if the word referred to actual fascists and not everyone who even slightly disagrees with you.
Also, I don’t think physical violence against people based on their political views is justified, no matter how horrendous the views are.
I don’t believe in solving problems with aggression, but I’ve never held it against anyone who punched a Nazi. I don’t approve, but I don’t lose sleep if others choose differently.
I suppose to be fair, I would feel the same about any violent authoritarian political view, not exclusively fascism.
Even if the left is overall more tolerant, there’s still plenty of toxicity that alienates people and pushes them rightward.
Because reality has a left-wing bias.
Heh. Because lefties are just conservatives who got mugged by reality, and once that happens there’s no going back? ;-)
I don’t know what that has to do with anything. I’m a lefty, life has never mugged me. I’m a leftist because bad things happen to everyone and the solutions isn’t to hurt people until they’re better people. Giving people time and resources just makes people and society better.
In general and on the aggregate, I am with you.
However, as an anecdote, I took in a couple of very conservative Christians who got evicted, gave them time (to pay off bills) and resources (food, water, power, internet, a bed, a roof…now at 4 months), and they’re not lifting a finger to help around the house and expect our kid to do their dishes and take out their trash.
Sometimes people are just selfish greedy assholes and there’s no changing that even with time and resources. And trust me they will be getting evicted from my house quite soon (with proper notification by state law).
I hope this experience doesn’t make me a bitter old fool. I truly do. Because I love the concept of helping others, it just tends to backfire more than I’d like.
One could argue that as alot of us are exredditors we would be the more progressive or left side of the crowd. Something happened we didn’t like so we left it behind for something we hope will be better and put in the effort to make it so as opposed to staying with what we know and really waiting things out before choosing a new direction. It would have been easy to stay with reddit, hell I could go back in an instant and it would be like I never left, but I chose this new path and I’m sticking with it. That is what progress is all about
People seeking to be free from corporate overlords, and desiring a place to speak their minds and who also don’t have an issue with spending a little time and effort tend to have a more liberal mindset. Regrettably as primates, we also have a tendency to form tribes and give short shrift to any viewpoints outside of those we ourselves believe in. I personally would prefer a dialogue of equals where we can debate our differences and agree to disagree or even find the places where we do agree and can come together. However, that enlightened state of being escapes most all of us. Instead, I will regress to thumping my chest and hooting at you.
throws poo
There are sections of both the right and the left that have anti-authoritarian tendancies.
The libertarian right tends to view things purely in terms of government over reach, whilst the left tends to view things in terms of the power of capital.
Leftists saw Facebook pushing propaganda for the highest bidder, Reddit trying to be safe to sell to investors and twitter basically becoming a project to reflect Elon Musk’s personal opinions.
Out of that came a bunch of attempts at creating new social networks. The right wing attempts were not cognisant that the aforementioned were the natural result of trying to get rich off it, while the left attempted to make it impossible to get into that position.
the right loves corporations it doesn’t go out of its way to avoid them
Right-wing propaganda would have you believe that most good things are left-wing (and thus bad).
Right-wing propaganda would have you believe that most good things are left-wing
One of the few things I agree with them on!
People looking for a Reddit alternative don’t tend to be conservatives and liberals. r/worldnews fits their needs perfectly.
Thus the migration is either to a left platform like Lemmy, or truth social etc for super right winger.
It skews young, and young skews left.
Now if only young voted…
Lemmy users seem older than most social media to me. Why is Star Trek TNG so popular here if not?
Re-runs.
TNG has young fans and you can have enough old farts like me around to populate a TNG forum while the whole is still mostly younger.
Education.
No for real, a lot of right-wing thinking comes from just parroting disinformation and being in their own echo chamber circles.
Educated people are more likely to ‘lean left’:
Environment: Higher education institutions often emphasize critical thinking, questioning of traditional norms, and exposure to diverse perspectives. This can lead individuals to adopt more progressive or liberal views.
Diversity: College and university settings are typically more diverse, exposing students to different cultures, ideas, and lifestyles.
Rationalism: Educated individuals may place a higher value on scientific reasoning and empirical evidence, which can align more with policies and positions typically associated with the left, such as support for climate change action and public health initiatives.
Perspective: Higher education can lead to an understanding of economic inequality and systemic issues. Educated individuals might support policies aimed at reducing inequality and improving social welfare.
Career: Many educated individuals work in fields such as academia, healthcare, and social services, where left-leaning values like equity, public good, and social justice are prevalent.
Generational: Younger generations, who are more likely to be college-educated today than in the past, tend to have more progressive views on social issues, such as LGBTQ+ rights and racial equality.
Education is also ‘pushed’ by a lot of adults when I was a kid. I thought it was kinda normal / lame because duh, of course it’s important. I didn’t get grasp deepl WHY until I was older and realized it’s really a root causal issue of today’s problems.
Educated people are more likely to ‘lean left’
I would qualify that as “Educated people with a conscience and a good ethical or moral base”.
There are plenty of very smart, very evil right wingers out there.
Mitch McConnell, Manchin, Shkrelli, Ben Shapiro… I suppose you have a point.
I wouldn’t say FOSS is inherently leftist, but it’s certainly not a capitalist approach.
And Lemmy has been developed by two outspoken Marxists, so the earliest adopters before the larger waves of reddit exilees had a similar mindset.
Add to the fact that most of the oldest and therefore largest communities are hosted on lemmy.ml, which is run by the original devs, and features moderators who by and large also share a similar mindset (and suppress critical comments quite a bit), and you’ve got a lefty echo chamber going, that’s spilling into the newer communities on neutral instances, giving the whole platform a left touch.
I once wrote a comment on a lemmy.ml page about China being authoritarian and my comment was removed, with a note saying “China isn’t authoritarian, stop spreading misinformation” LMAO. Delusional people
Indeed. I happen to live in China, and everybody calls it authoritarian, especially the locals.
They’re not delusional, they’re paid.
Why would they be paid for a software that can be used for free, to create larger servers than their owns, with completely separate communities they have nothing to say about?
Doesn’t seem like a very effective strategy
Because the Fediverse is a great target for propaganda, which is invaluable for some authoritarian countries.
Lemmy is an echochamber with relatively limited, uncoordinated moderation. 1,000,000+ monthly active users, and lemmy.ml is a flagship instance.
This is my understanding as well. History of the platform skews it left.
But I also don’t think in terms of left and right (though its hard to get away from the terms so widely used). For instance, most people tend to describe the difference in terms of money and profit (capitalism). I look at control and freedom. I don’t want governments controlling what we see, hear, and say. I want us all to control our own lives. Lemmy/Fedi is completely supportive of that concept.
I don’t want governments controlling what we see, hear, and say.
Might want to find a new instance
For the most part, the same ethos that powers the Fediverse is the same ethos that powers all open-source. So naturally the people that would be more keen to adopt it are the people who believe in the Open Source model in general.
I can’t think of anything less right-wing than open source; it’s essentially software communism (“from each according to their ability to each according to their need”) Sharing isn’t a right-wing value.
Maybe because it was originally developed as a platform to discuss Marxism and Leninism?
I think it’s more that you don’t get many right-wing extremists and the mods don’t protect the ones that do exist from seeing things they don’t like.
There are still a lot of neoliberal kind of conservatives on lemmy, and then also right-wing types in the form of tankies, but for the most part I think the light touch by most of the moderators means that facts (which favor the “left”) tend to be allowed to persist in a way they don’t on many social media that see profit in extremist content.
