- cross-posted to:
- memes@lemmy.world
- cross-posted to:
- memes@lemmy.world
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I’m currently a stay at home husband who does all the cooking, cleaning and dishes. I never felt manlier and have never been so attractive to women (according to my wifes friends at least). Looking forward to our first child arriving soon.
I have plenty of single male friends who seem stuck in their early 20s (even though they’re approaching 40). Their only care in the world seem to be “the economy” (something they barely understand), and whatever the newest *-maxxing scam is being promoted on Instagram that will magically make women gravitate towards them. They’re all pretty good looking and mostly nice people. The main problem being that they’re cheapskates and won’t lift a finger for anything not directly benefitting themselves. They don’t know how to cook, and learning anything unrelated to their jobs is seen as a “waste of time”.
I’m very happy I didn’t get stuck in that sort of rut as I’ve seen how easy it was for my friends.
A lot of women find empathy sexy. The women who only go for alpha males are the ones you usually want to avoid.
Alpha male isn’t even a thing. Not even in nature. People who call themselves that are mostly delusional assholes no-one likes.
To add onto that, the guy that originally published the “alpha male” study spent a lot of time trying to correct public views and publish corrective studies because he discovered the behavior was only in wolves kept in captivity. IIRC.
It’s kind of a thing in certain animals, but not wolves like originally claimed. The certain animals here being mostly primates, so it’s even more applicable.
That said, the politics of social primates are notoriously complex and many cultures have unique behaviors within the species, so there aren’t really any universal rules particularly among the most social groups.
TBH, Silverbacks are actually good role models: Big, bulky, sit around grooming the troupe, know everyone, emotionally support everyone, when someone wants to start a fight, intervenes, “You wanna fight? Yeah, fight me! Both of you at once, if need be!” – and then suddenly the others lost interest in fighting.
Proverbial gymbro speaking softly and carrying a big stick, far from a tyrant, you know the type. Chimpanzees are the closest to us, with warfare and everything. Bonobos are… well, they are what biologists start talking about when they want to get into your pants. Let’s just say there’s a reason you don’t see them in zoos, parents don’t want to hear kids asking those kinds of questions.
Isn’t it weird that for humans, sex is a private matter? Completely singular among all the animals. And that’s independent of social status, like a smaller sea lion seducing a female one while the big hunk de jure leading the pack isn’t looking, it’s universal. Even if sex is a group activity, then that group itself is putting up layers of privateness and propriety. Swinger clubs with fancy dress codes, doesn’t matter if you end up naked but you have to start out in suit and tie.
If a scientist would, today, discover humanity and describe their behaviour they’d be laughed out of any conference, “did you get your notes mixed up”. “Next thing you want to tell us camelopards are real”.
Most people can pull a trigger.
Right on my dad was my stay at home parent when I was little and he was a green beret in Vietnam. He was by far my most nurturing and loving parent. I was very lucky to have had him
Reading this, specifically had me think of an old friend i had. He was always sceming. Every time i saw him he had a new one. Weather he was stealing company supplies from his employer, so he could start his own landscaping business, or asking me to use my doordash account, or wanting me to help him start a flower business, which i never helped with any of it because i dont agree with lying/cheating through life, while every bit of his life seemed some backdoor plan- I would have dated him, once apon a time, but ten years into the friendship, he sent me a ben Shapiro video, a d a few years ago, i terminated the friendship. Every thing was transactional with that man. He was good looking and kind, but my god these traits were such a turn off, I dont care if you work at hime depot, or the hardware store- my husband today is a chef- its better than scheming to rip someone off so you can get ahead. Thats selfish imo.
There really is a bit of a catch-22 in my book that’s centered completely around self confidence. If you are proud of who you are, if you are living up to your ideals, you are simultaneously much more attractive to others, and at the same time you realize that you don’t need others - but they sure are the cherry on top.
Surely you would learn to cook your own food if you are a cheapskate? It’s so much cheaper making your own, I had to through necessity for a long time. While I already knew a few recipes I generally couldn’t afford them when I moved out. Beef mince? Hah! Not a chance.
Turns out making your own sourdough pizza from scratch is crazy cheap. Cheese is the most expensive part.
I’m currently a stay at home husband who does all the cooking, cleaning and dishes.
Easy to throw stones when you’re not the one responsible for keeping the lights on.
Who’s throwing stones? These friends are clearly unhappy and only getting worse because of dumb shit on social media. I’d help them if they’d listen.
You are.
The main problem being that they’re cheapskates and won’t lift a finger for anything not directly benefitting themselves. They don’t know how to cook, and learning anything unrelated to their jobs is seen as a “waste of time”
Maybe they’re stuck trying to get ahead in their career and don’t have the mental energy to focus on anything else. Most single dudes I know are focused on their careers because where they’re at doesn’t meet their needs or isn’t enough to meet their goals even if the goal is as simple as just owning a home and be able to retire someday.
There’s not a male loneliness epidemic.
There’s a loneliness epidemic.
https://www.hhs.gov/sites/default/files/surgeon-general-social-connection-advisory.pdf
“Joking” by trying to turn this into men vs women is pretty gross.
It is a parody of the incel belief system, not actually meant to represent an equal cross section of society
It can be read either way.
It’s also simple enough in structure to be generated slop and the OP could just be an automated account.
It’s hard to say what is true, but on the face of it we should all be able to agree that it would be a bigoted opinion to express literally, out loud and in public.
(Like the OP is doing)
The title should be different but the meme stands on its own. The clown has built a logical fallacy of why he is lonely. To me this is a jab at incel beliefs and doesn’t have a deeper meaning
maybe people want to talk about the deeper meaning behind the jab . does that make you uncomfortable? there is a nice place called Reddit where you might fit in, if so
Lol, you see how I have been respectful but you are not, it would seem you are the redditor
This meme is not turning it into a men versus women thing. It’s mocking people who do by calling them clowns.
It’s the 1% vs the working class, not gender vs gender.
Memes is now shitting on genders ? Y’all fuckers don’t know shit about empathy, and about memes either.
The guys saying the top three things aren’t necessarily the same as those saying the bottom thing. But there is definitely some overlap. Which is depressing. Though, I mean is that really that surprising given the state of the world and how stupid the average person is?
The loneliness epidemic also effects women. We’re all more lonely and miserable these days. I think really men and women are alienated from each other in large numbers due to internet brain rot. And being too broke to do anything outside except like… go to a public park or a library or something.
The shitty rightwing politics comes after, the average person is too stupid to not get immediately sucked into manipulative rightwing grift when they’re painfully lonely.
I say this as I consume internet brain rot myself. Though at least its on Lemmy and not Tik Tok, Reddit, or Facebook, and its during work, not my free time.
boss makes a dollar,
i make a dime,
that’s why i Lemmy
on company timeBest time to do anything is company time.
But going to the park or beach is fun. My first date with my partner was drinking cider on a park bench by a river.
Not everyone loves meandering around a park or beach. Though I’ll admit its good for our brains to do so. It always feels like a chore to me, I get bored.
Also was it alcoholic cider? That would explain why it was fun.
Also those places aren’t really great for meeting people and even then you don’t want to make those locations the only dating locations.
Cider is always alcoholic in the UK unless specifically sold as low alcohol. Typically first dates are not the same place you first meet someone.
Typically first dates are not the same place you first meet someone.
I know, but that there aren’t a lot of places to meet people in person without spending a bunch of money is a major problem and meeting people online to date sucks.
My first date with ny husband we went on a walk on a trail near our home. We walked for 6 hours lol
This is just a toxic gender wars meme. Go outside, touch some grass, meet someone nice and move on with life. Memes like this come from and perpetuate the loneliness epidemic.
Couldn’t agree more, matey :)
Accurately observing that the “male loneliness epidemic” is self-inflicted bullshit isn’t “toxic gender wars” except if you are a right wing traitor lunatic.
Edit: if you genuinely believe there is a male loneliness epidemic that is not self-inflicted, you deserve a whole lot worse than prison.
Wow yikes. You sound like fun at parties. Go find someone to care about.
For the record, I think there is a loneliness epidemic for both genders.
People who say “you must be fun at parties” deserve a whole lot worse than prison.
> capitalism
> self-inflictedSure, bud.
Lmao is a worthless traitor dumbfuck trying to pretend that capitalism is the root cause of “male loneliness”? That’s some bottom of the barrel thinking even for incels. Reminds me of the braincel shitbag who said women should be redistributed via Marxism. Shore bud indeed, traitor.
Alienation. Exploitation. Heard of it?
Capitalism has bereft men even of the patriarchal provider role as there’s no fucking time in the day to earn both rent and have any type of social interaction, much less time to reflect on your approach to life. Your position as a gear churning out profit for the bosses has been meticulously designed and drilled into you while you were a kid, blind obedience instilled by teachers and BS “zero tolerance punish the victim” rules. There is no use for you aside from that assigned role, happiness, connection, community, work//life balance? Don’t make a profit. Get out of here with that commie nonsense we have quarterly figures to hit.
Or, maybe, yes, you do have a point: I should have said late-stage capitalism. The internal contradictions are actively eroding it by now.
That’s not at all what people mean at all. Men are not more alienated than any other gender by capitalist lunacy. This “male loneliness epidemic” is a euphemism for late stage male supremacy.
You’re right after that comes the patriarchal, or just gendered, double-whammy: Women culturally do have more of a support network, even just in the “friends hanging out” way, as the male “do things together, chop wood, go fishing” is regarded as work, not leisure, and thus co-opted by capitalism: “What do you need to chop food and fish for, go buy fuel and food are you poor or something”. Thus all the productive time men have is spent in a hierarchical worker-boss environment, never “pals doing stuff”, cue loss of connection, alienation from broader society, loneliness. Going bowling? Time not spent hustling, you’re a loser. That’s your mind on patriarchal capitalism.
Thus, even if the starting conditions inflicted by capitalism are, for the sake of argument, completely even, it still hits men harder when it comes to loneliness. Women are more affected in other ways. This isn’t an olympics, it’s analysis of the material conditions we live under.
I’ll add that people aren’t being hugged, & touched enough. Also, infrastructure sucks to encourage socializing
Its an epidemic of that. We are social creatures. That’s our main motto
When we work together, live in groups, etc we all feel better. Reminds us of our tribe days
A big part of human connection is being physical with each other in a chill way. So try to hug your bros more, & get things done as a unit with women!
Both sides are supposed to be allies to each other
the problem is that incels focusing in that problem think that they are owed sex and attention from attractive women. when the real solution of to develop and use third spaces, and develop social connections of any kind.
This was a pivotal video about “nice guys” I watched growing up that imo everyone should watch.
Favorite line:
This is not a transaction where you walk up to the cashier and pull out your nice bucks and buy sex and romance.
Unfortunately, many men think hugging or touching each other is effeminate and gay.
- Women are male lonliness
- Everything and everyone is weakness
- I’ve made hating dishwashers my entire personality
- There’s a empathy epidemic
Boys are taught to ignore emotions (“are you crying? Man up!”)
But emotions is what connects humans (and animals for that matter) and can’t really be ignored anyway
Join the two… and you get loneliness, frustration, rage.
We should start a conversation on emotional education (not only for boys but especially for boys)
Because nobody wants men to be emotional. When I started opening up is when my marriage started falling apart lol
If opening up is what caused the marriage to fall apart, it was built on a broken foundation and was doomed from the start. You’re only finding out now because emotional unavailability hides that sort of thing.
Yeah happens even before marriage.
Yeah I ain’t ever showing emotions again except to a paid professional lmao.
Most women want someone very emotionally stable
Lol maybe talk to nicer women?
It’s not a “niceness” thing it’s instinctual
I just want to butt in that while the meme is stupid, most women are not awful either.
No of course they aren’t. Who said they are?
I’m saying women are put off my emotional instability aka “showing your feelings”
That’s so fucking silly
Why? Women want stability and protection usually
You’d be surprised
Yeah as I said… emotional education should not be only for boys.
Sorry mate (or congratulation… depending from the context 🙂)
I think it’s in our nature.
I’ve seen no evidence that these kinds of traits are inherently biological.
Regardless of the fact that we have significant evidence that these more “new” forms of masculinity that incorporate less domineering and aggressive mannerisms are beneficial to men, I simply haven’t seen any evidence that these traits are biological.
In the same way that when you don’t socialize a child to prefer certain clothes or toys, (or stigmatize against them) they generally just go with what they prefer in the moment along lines that don’t match the gender binary, from what I’ve seen, the same is generally true for behaviors. We’re heavily influenced by our cultures and by extension, our upbringing, to a degree that explains why these mannerisms are commonly expressed along gendered lines.
Having kids changed my view. Originally I believed nature influenced our gender roles. Since having kids I have seen in my kids and others that there are clear differences in how both boys and girls interact with the world and both are pretty incredible to watch. I think maybe the idea that being more stoic and less emotional is ok.
Saying all that, there are definitely cultural influences that can take these inherent traits to toxic levels.
I’d like to see studies showing when kids are left to their own that they will trend towards non traditional gender based toys. My gut is believing that this may not need proof that girls and boys do not experience emotions with similar intensity.
One thing I think is a clear difference is attention to details between men and women. What I worry is that if we start thinking men and women are more similar than they are we could run into problems when average people wrongly assume the other experiences things they do.
they generally just go with what they prefer in the moment along lines that don’t match the gender binary
Nope. Lego did a large behavioural study on this because this was their assumption, they thought they were doing completely gender-neutral stuff, but even controlling for parents’s biases their stuff wasn’t gender-neutral when it came to actually be interesting to kids. I’m talking about stuff like the city series, here: A street, bunch of houses, bunch of minifigs. Figures that the girls by and large where looking at the inside of the buildings, finding them empty, and lost interest while boys where seeing the streets, found ample of detail and also a car to drive around, and created stories. There are, of course, as always exceptions to the binary but the overall trend was undeniable.
That (and the insistence of US stores on not having gender-neutral isles and putting Lego in the boy’s section) made them create the Friends series: Detailed house interiors, larger, more detailed minifigs. The pink is for the stores and parents, the interiors for the girls, the build-what-you-want flexibility for the humans.
Generally speaking, I think that difference feminism has been discarded prematurely. Sure, none of the normative BS that many of its proponents espoused should ever see the light of day, but denying difference is harmful in its own way, and the reason is the inevitability of essentialising: If you say “there is no difference at all between men and women” you’re bound to essentialise everyone towards your own gender. And it’s way better to be essentialised as an apple when you’re an apple than it is to be essentialised as a pear.
Lego did a large behavioural study on this because this was their assumption, they thought they were doing completely gender-neutral stuff, but even controlling for parents’s biases their stuff wasn’t gender-neutral when it came to actually be interesting to kids.
Interesting. I can’t seem to find anything on this study, but maybe that’s just my search engine not providing very relevant results.
What is a relevant result is the study from just a few years ago that Lego also commissioned, which they’re using to justify making their product lines more gender neutral, after finding that:
“girls today feel increasingly confident to engage in all types of play and creative activities, but remain held back by society’s ingrained gender stereotypes” and that “Girls […] are more open towards different types of creative play compared to what their parents and society typically encourage.”
And they found a significant effect from parents pushing their kids into certain interests and hobbies influencing the behaviors of children:
Our insights further indicate that girls are typically encouraged into activities that are more cognitive, artistic and related to performance compared to boys who are more likely to be pushed into physical and STEM-like activities (digital, science, building, tools). Parents from this study are almost five times as likely to encourage girls over boys to engage in dance (81% vs. 19%) and dress-up (83% vs. 17%) activities, and over three times as likely to do the same for cooking/baking (80% vs. 20%). Adversely, they are almost four times as likely to encourage boys over girls to engage in program games (80% vs. 20%) and sports (76% vs. 24%) and over twice as likely to do the same when it comes to coding toys (71% vs. 29%)
And they even showed that kids felt pressured not to engage in cross-gendered play, even when they wanted to:
71% of boys vs. 42% of girls say they worry about being made fun of if they play with a toy typically associated for the other gender.
Now, a quick note on your other point.
If you say “there is no difference at all between men and women” you’re bound to essentialise everyone towards your own gender.
I don’t believe there is no difference at all between men and women. I simply believe that a lot of the things we say are inherent differences are actually not as inherent as people tend to believe.
For example, I’ve seen no evidence that women are inherently more kind/caring/empathetic than men in any biological way, only that society socializes them to be so, and thus we see that trend perpetuated over time. Yet if you ask most people, they’ll assume there’s something biological that makes women more like that emotionally.
I don’t believe there is no difference at all between men and women. I simply believe that a lot of the things we say are inherent differences are actually not as inherent as people tend to believe.
Depending on who you mean with “we” I definitely agree.
For example, I’ve seen no evidence that women are inherently more kind/caring/empathetic than men in any biological way, only that society socializes them to be so,
…and fails at doing so, if I may add. Male-pattern aggression is simply more obvious because it’s in your face physical while female-pattern is psychological, always ensuring plausible deniability.
Yet if you ask most people, they’ll assume there’s something biological that makes women more like that emotionally.
Women favour low-risk engagement, passive aggressiveness over overt aggressiveness. Thus you see emotional manipulation used way more often, one approach being self-victim-framing, and for that the narrative of “oh women are so delicate and emotional they have to be protected no matter what they do” fits the bill. Female viciousness is beautiful but I very much prefer it in the “never start a fight, but always finish it” version. Relevant symphonic metal. Also if you’re trying it with me you’re getting tickled into submission.
Do you realise that kids before puberty don’t have much difference from biological point of view. Sexual organs are not developed or fully developed and no hormones to speak of.
The story of Lego you said… cool you can control parents behaviour… what about peer pressure? Or the idea was to control the parents of a whole town (including Cartoons and TV shows)?
Boys develop coarse motor skills first, then fine motor skills, for girls it’s the other way around. Which also means that girls are quite good at sitting still in primary school, boys, without getting tired out in recess, very much aren’t. Cue “behavioural issues”.
Lego did control for everything that could be controlled. They’re the OG “our toys are for everyone” company. They thought that their stuff was gender neutral, that stores and parents, society, were the problem, but had to admit that, no, kids actually do have, statistically speaking, different play preferences. Their female set designers didn’t catch it because they were not kids, any more.
And “no hormones to speak of” MF if there were no hormones involved male karyotypes would develop female.
When all your “friends” are alpha bro podcasters trying to get you to buy shit, yeah you’re gonna be lonely.
The young men’s version of a facebook MLM group.
Empathy being both a weakness and a sin…
What more proof do you need that America is a failed state?
Ah, the classic generalization of men and women as singular groups where everyone acts as one.
There are certain shitty men who objectify women and play alphas. There is the general category of men who get shitted at because of it, whether they belong to the former or not.
Sure, being afraid of the shitty folks is a valid reason to be cautious around everyone, as you can’t easily tell one from the other. But saying that all men just made this stuff up while being total asses wouldn’t be fair or helpful.
To be clear: there is a male loneliness epidemic driven by ever increasing caution about men overall. Men are often unfairly denied attention they need because they are seen as potential dangers by women and might be ridiculed for speaking out about their feelings by men (which, in turn, do it to protect themselves from the same treatment in an unhealthy patriarchal culture).
This is not healthy; moreover, being in that state of loneliness and frustration is prone to radicalizing people, making sayings about dangerous men a self-fulfilling prophecy in one case, and just causing a lot of misery in the other.
If you’re a woman, I’d suggest giving a bit of attention to the men around you. There is a million of untold stories there, and making someone open up to you for the first time is a great and rewarding experience. Or just…be there, and that will be appreciated.
My wife sometimes stops to compliment me because she knows men don’t often receive compliments. I always appreciate that.
That’s how you know she should be your wife :)
But really, this should be more normalized. I’ve heard the opinion that many men see compliments as a way to show sympathy when that wasn’t intended, but I think this is exactly because it’s so rare.
My girlfriend also takes time to compliment me, and I appreciate it.
Uh where’s the generalization here? The post didn’t say “all men” anywhere in it. It’s suggesting that people who say the first things lead to saying the later things, leading to their loneliness. Not every man is lonely… but a lot who are make everyone uncomfortable because of the shit they say.
Valid perspective; but I think it’s quite clearly implied given the scale of the issue. The male loneliness is real, and shouldn’t be written off as shit misogynists say, even if it was popularized by them. This kind of discarding might hurt men who have nothing to do with misogynistic talking points, opinions, or actions.
I don’t think the loneliness epidemic is uniquely male though. It’s an affliction of this entire generation. There is a specific subset of men that have been radicalized against women as a scapegoat for the loneliness they feel, but the true cause is increasing social alienation driven by capitalism. The specific mechanism not being limited to the commodification of our attention that has been enabled by the advent of high speed internet.
Absolutely! Everyone gets lonelier as we are getting divided; it’s just that it’s even harder on men specifically, as there are additional factors at play. But it doesn’t mean women don’t experience similar things.
I disagree strongly and I don’t think you get what I’m saying. It’s not a competition and there’s no need to dismiss the feelings of one side or the other. If you are a man, and especially if you are occupied by a specific focus on men, you cannot know the extent of women’s loneliness or the impact that it has on women. The same goes vice versa. The issue is too nebulous, too subjective and complexly intertwined with too many different aspects of our lives as humans. It’s a fool’s errand.
It doesn’t matter who has it harder, because the root cause is the same. Addressing this root cause will help every person experiencing loneliness in the modern age regardless of gender. Any other solution is just treating the symptoms and will inevitably result in people being left out and marginalized. People who matter. It will inevitably result in division, which hurts our ability to unite and fight for a common cause.
This stoking of a needless war between the genders is a counter-revolutionary tactic employed by the ruling class to keep us fighting amongst ourselves instead of challenging their power. They want us focused on pushing forward half-measures; measures that can be easily struck down, agitated against, that will keep us going in circles; measures that do not fundamentally challenge the systems that created these issues in the first place and, in fact, depend on the persistence of these issues.
I totally agree with you that gender wars are artificial and meant to distract people from the core issues. Divide and conquer kinda thing.
But that sits exactly at the core of my initial argument. Blaming wide groups of people, among other things, provides completely unnecessary wars out of thin air.
This doesn’t deny the fact that people of each gender may face issues that are gender-specific to some degree. Men are more likely to be socially isolated, women are more likely to become victims of sexual abuse, etc. etc. This doesn’t mean we should measure who has it worse, but it has to be taken into consideration if we want to correct the course and make everyone actually equal. In this case, we need to address specific sources of male loneliness, as there are some factors unique to men that lead to this.
People acting on gender issues together, not as two divided groups, is a great exercise in civil power and unity, which is helpful for any revolutionary activity.
That’s their problem for feeling entitled to human interaction. You need to learn that none of us really matter, and the only one you can trust is yourself.
Learn to be content with just being, and surviving, or perish.
I’m really sorry you feel that way, genuinely, but this deeply antisocial sentiment is not a depiction of a reality that is compatible with human life. Please seek help from a qualified professional. I mean that.
More sociological insights from the keen minds who teach us you need a small penis to like sports cars.
What?
Anybody can create a meme, but too many people get too much of their “information” from them.
I mean, ok but I’m not really sure what you mean still. Who are you referring to? I mean it could be many people I suppose, but it usually depends on the memes they’re consuming.
lets be honest, people who need a large gender affirming car are fun to laugh at.
need a large gender affirming car
???
This is a projection of your own brainrot sexism, nothing more.
Don’t try to make it sound like you ever mocked a woman for having a large car, either, you’re not fooling anyone with “people”, lol.
oh no, I offended a conservative, the most easily offended demographic.
why don’t you go listen to some podcasts and cry about it
You said something stupid, and it was identified as such. That’s not being offended.
Though the fact that you had to assume several things about me personally to rationalize the way you behave, as your ego is apparently just too fragile to conceive of the possibility that YTA, says a lot, and makes me wonder if you’re available in IMAX.
Not as laughable as the assumption that “needing a large gender affirming car” was the actual reason someone bought a car, without knowing anything about them except that they’re male. Maybe that proves psychic powers are real too!
way to many massive trucks look like they never touched actually work and are used for commute.
no need for that, and truck owners like them because they are manly, so basically gender affirming cars
Downvoted for being unnecessarily antagonistic.
if the problem is that men have loneliness issues i have a solution.
it’s men, more than one, become friends.
is there a issue with modern social alienation caused by individual atomisation? yes.
should we focus on it? yes
does it mean that women owe them sex? fuck no,
Are these the same guys that think that eating pussy makes you gay?
It’s no fucking wonder they’re lonely.
Have they tried not being assholes?
Sopranos confirmed that…never made sense…
Anyone who says that has never been offered pussy, at least not twice. I ate pussy before I fucked pussy, although it happenned in short succession
I have always found that being good at it is a very good way to be invited back. It’s the least gay thing that you can do.
