I’m under no illusions that Linux is a viable alternative for everyone, but if you’re just using your computer as a web terminal and light gaming system, a decent Linux system + Steam makes for a very usable option these days.
I have exactly one computer in my house that has Windows on it. It was provided by my employer, and I turn it on maybe once every two weeks or so, for special-purpose activities that can’t be done on my Linux laptop. And most of the time, for most activities my Linux laptop is the clearly superior performer - it’s not even close, despite their similar hardware specs.
I don’t think everyone should - or can - switch. But if you’ve got an old beater laptop gathering dust, try popping Ubuntu or something on it, see how it performs. See if it’s something you could legitimately switch to full or part time.
Is Linux still a good option for gaming if one were to not purchase games?
Yes, you can either add the game as a non-steam game and force proton, or use Lutris or Bottles (with proton or other WINE runner). For repacks with installers, you can launch the setup.exe with Lutris or Bottles (install the game to ‘fake’ drive_c and move it), just make sure you include dependencies that require it (usually .net framework).
Source: most of my steam library on my steam deck is plundered loot
There are also repackers like jc141 e LinuxRulez that also manage the dependencies and prefix for you. LinuxRulez also gives you appropriate Wine versions if needed
Not to necro this thread, but lets say someone I know has gotten copy of a repack and when they try to install it with Lutris it says they don’t have enough disk space to run the installer, is it possible to create the wine bottle and specify the size of it before launching the installer?
Are you installing it to the C drive? There’s directory called drive_c, which will look like a windows C drive.
Lutris is good for that. It can be confusing at first if you don’t know how Wine works, but it’s very easy to use and doesn’t require Steam.
I find Bottles it’s less confusing than Lutris, (though it’s not UX perfect), and a better suggestion for people starting off with gaming.
Though Steam is the number one suggestion. If all your games run through Steam then you don’t even need to worry about Bottles or Lutris.
not purchase games?
😏
Yes, Steam doesn’t do anything
You can just as easily use Wine/Proton as your runner as you can set up Steam to use Wine/Proton as your runner
Sure. I’ve run several modern … repurposed… games and it usually works through lutris.
yes but steam is so easy
Steam works on Linux.
yeah and it is very easy
Yes, but it will take some learning time
You could say this for almost any linux usability question lol
I think that for most people linux is the most simple OS to use, switched my parents and sister computer to Linux Mint and they don’t ask me to help them with windows changing their browser or moving their icons every two weeks. Though if you are trying to do anything more than web browsing, document editing and listening to music, you will have to learn how some of the os works.
At this point in time, I only occasionally have mild issues with newest games, because Wine is a continuously developed software, and games with an annoying anticheat, such as Destiny 2 or R6 Siege. Everything else just runs, including older games, that don’t even run on Windows, or titles you had to sail the seas for
Yeah it’s great. Bottles is the best tool imo, lutris almost feels like a relic from the early days of Linux gaming, and non-steam games in steam don’t always work exactly how you might want, and aren’t so much fun. There is also heroic games launcher now which lets you add custom games and is also a very nice option if you don’t use gnome (bottles is a gnome style app so it may look out of place elsewhere). I would put some thorough research into VPNs if you torrent though because the one I used on my Linux box (expressvpn) leaked my ip at some point and I got a letter in the mail.
Take your piracy back to the piracy sub
Take your ignorance elsewhere
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I’m a gamer. I’ve used Windows since the 95 days. I’m done with Microsoft. I was not happy with Windows 10 and the bullshit they introduced but there is no way in hell I’m signing up for Win11.
Steam has made a lot of progress with Proton. My next computer will be Linux-based.
It’s getting pretty easy to ditch Windows these days. Microsoft got too greedy and desperate, and actually using the damn platform they built is getting harder and harder, especially if you don’t want the nagging and annoyances that come from them trying to turn your computer into their subscription revenue stream. My impression is that Valve is aware of the problem, and wants to make sure that their store works regardless of which operating system you prefer.
Valve is and was aware of this problem even back then. I don’t have a reliable source on this but from what I remember it all started when Microsoft begun pushing the Microsoft Store.
Gabe Newell even said Linux is the future of gaming
And for this I have a source: https://www.pcgamer.com/gabe-newell-linux-and-open-source-are-the-future-of-gaming/
You’ll be just fine. So long as they fix the issues with anticheat software at some point. Gaming on linux is great these days in most cases though.
Yeah this is so true. I have a gaming laptop with Linux on it and a steam deck. If it doesn’t run on Linux, I don’t buy it. The problem is that strategy isn’t really saving me any money these days.
There’s a real sense of relief whenever I close my (work) windows laptop and open my personal Pop_OS laptop… and then start up Baldur’s Gate.
I’ve been primarily a Linux user for several years now and it seems like Windows is just getting worse and worse in terms of user experience. I fear the day that my company wants everyone to move to Win11.
I’m just hoping 12 is better… somehow… and soon? I loathe 11.
Give me GOG Galaxy and Path of Exile on Linux and I would install it now. Last time I wanted to switch, I installed everything I needed, went to download GOG and remembered why I switch back last time. :(
I haven’t tried installing gog but I do play path of exile on Linux, with a controller. Flawless ( my distro off choice is nobara)
Nice, I will have to look into that.
I use Lutris to install my GOG games, Battle.NET, EA launcher, and Ubisoft Play. It’s a very simple solution.
I use heroic launcher, works perfectly for me
How or why does Linux have a higher performance for you?
not OP but similar situation. My Linux desktop is just more snappy, despite being 5 years old (and the work Win11 laptop brand new). I already have customized with my shortcuts and apps. I don’t have to listen to the fan spinning up every time I open a new window (exaggerating a bit, but not much). Also I am not tied to work filters. If I want to read the news online for 5 minutes in a coffee break I don’t risk being monitored and potentially evaluated. But really, I’ve been a Windows and Linux user for 20-odd years. I’ve always found that Linux installed on the same hardware of Windows is just smoother and faster. Windows is getting so much bloatware (from MS or enterprise apps) that it doesn’t even have a fighting chance.
Most desktop environments are really efficient at what they do and minimize the background resources they take. Just checked my system and GNOME takes ~350MBs RAM (~700MB including gnome-software) and literally 0.0% CPU, it’s insane. I looked up Windows 11 and it seems like it can use up to 4 GBs (!) of RAM all by itself.
It can and will if you let it
My comment isn’t really a viable argument but I’ve been thinking about how an advert for Linux would be:
“The top 500 supercomputers in the world run Linux, don’t you want to feel like having a supercomputer at home? Why wait? Get your Linux for free today!”
Not really to be taken seriously, but if you want a real argument and example:
My laptop is really laggy with windows 10, and it came preinstalled with it. Recently I tried dual-booting Linux and Windows, and Windows was simply too slow. I am so accustomed with Linux’s speed that I wiped Windows off it. Never again.
Memory management and file IO is far more efficient in Linux. So much so that I even got better performance in Windows running Debian in a VM for some very file-intensive stuff. And by better performance I mean a factor of about 10.
Also, MORE FILE SYSTEMS! NTFS is crap
Probably just down to less stuff running in the background using up CPU cycles. I can’t imagine it makes a huge difference, but more than nothing.
Depending on the situation, it actually can make huge differences.  For instance, I built my computer in 2010 it’s 13yrs old now. it can’t run windows 11 and while it can run windows 10 it runs like complete shit. Start up would take forever even on a fresh install, half the time Windows freezes just trying to get to the desktop after a fresh reboot. at idle background processes from windows would leave me running over 50% CPU usage just idling and opening anything like Firefox and Discord at the same time would jump to 100% CPU usage.
On Linux it runs just as good as the day I built it. Startup takes around 30 seconds and I can actually start working the moment I’m on the desktop, no freezing or waiting for background startup processes to finish. I currently at this moment have around 20 workspaces (aka virtual desktops) open across three monitors, within those work spaces is hundreds of tabs open in Firefox, simultaneously playing RuneScape and dwarf fortress. A bunch of terminals, SSH sessions, and other miscellaneous work stuff running. a ton of docker containers running, I also have both discord with a call going and Spotify playing in the background and I am setting at 30% CPU usage with the occasional spike to 50%. I can actually use my computer to do a ton of stuff and have power left over while windows would max out and freeze up just the start up, even on fresh installs. And it’s not just this one old computer, I can consistently see rather large performance differences going from Windows to Linux across the number of different computers. 
If I may ask, what distro did you settle on? I’m trying out a handful myself right now.
I’m on Fedora 38 with I3 WM and a few kde apps, originally installed as 35 and just upgraded since. Before that was arch briefly and before that was debian.  I went with Fedora because I need my computer to work without issue when it’s time to work and on arch I spent more time tinkering and getting things working then actually working. I still think just plain Debian a solid choice and I use it on a lot of servers but as a desktop, I felt like I ran into a lot of outdated packages. With Fedora I’m getting up-to-date packages yet I have never had an update break the system.  I also prefer DNF and their repository over apt and deb files. It’s all just personal preference though. You just gotta try them all and see what you like!
I appreciate you taking the time to describe why you chose Fedora; now I’m tempted to try it, lol. I’m downloading the 38 Budgie spin now and adding it to the list. (It’ll run like shit with apps until I upgrade the RAM on my Macbook, but the minimum hardware reqs are met and I can still look at it and see what it does out of the box.) Thanks!
Good luck on your Linux journey! I’ve never tried the Bungie spin, but Fedora is a very solid distro and I bet it’ll work great. Those MacBooks with Linux are so nice! I ran a 2011 MBP with a mix of plain Debian and Ubuntu for awhile and the battery life on that thing was amazing!
Also, the file system. For the longest time windows used NTFS exclusively, which is (or was) slower than Ext4 (the most widely used on Linux).
I think MS is moving away from NTFS and are going to use a different file system in the near future (maybe even now, I don’t know anymore)
I don’t think NTFS is the actual problem, but the Windows VFS layer (or whatever it’s called over there).
Running windirstat (or similar programs) is dog-slow on Windows, k4dirstat eats through the same partition quite a bit faster. Getting metadata to sort a directory with what 5000 files by modification time can take minutes in explorer, with Linux it’s pretty much instant. minutes. That’s not just non-optimised that’s abysmal.
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@kescusay Just out of interest, what are the “special-purpose activities that can’t be done on my Linux laptop” if you don’t mind sharing?
Running AAA games with kernel level anti-cheat (aka malware) would be an example.
Windows-exclusive software like some ERP client, specific hardware drivers etc. Also, there’s no real alternative for Excel, unfortunately (LibreOffice isn’t good enough).
For me, there are a few work-specific tasks that require our Windows-only VPN client in order to perform them. Fortunately, the bulk of my job isn’t like that.
Ironically enough, some of the Linux certification exams only work on Windows and macOS.
I’m gonna ride out Windows 10 since I’ve got it behaving and I’m lazy. But if Windows 12 is just like Windows 11, or worse, I’m switching to Linux and figuring out how to get a vGPU VM up and running for when I have to run something on Windows for one reason or another. I messed with a vGPU in Hyper-V on Windows and was amazed by how seamless the performance was compared to other VM GPU acceleration options. I found a project to do something similar on Linux, so I’m gonna mess with that. If I can get it running as well as I’ve seen in some videos, I won’t need a bare metal Windows install anymore.
You should probably just go ahead and switch now. It’s not going to get any better, at least not over one iteration. Maybe Windows 14…
Yeah same. When they do eventually kill 10 then im bailing for Firefox and Linux. I do also have it behaving but sometimes it tries the odd bullshit about edge.
And you can put windows in a virtual machine for edge cases for most use cases. Use Linux for everything else.
I would switch tomorrow if I didn’t play competitive CS that requires third-party anti-cheat like Faceit/ ESEA.
Which version of CS? Many of them work fine now.
CSGO. all those anti cheat clients are kernel level and only work on windows AFAIK
“Microsoft forced to stop forcing Windows 11 users into Edge in EU countries”, would be a more descriptive title.
But the multinational hyper-conglomerates are our friends and the most efficient use of capital!
Can they do the same for Google recommending Chrome?
At least google sites recommending Chrome are free to use. Microsoft is forcing is it’s useless browser to an audience via an OS. Which they paid for. Two huge no-no’s.
MS should just quit the facade and make it free.
I mean it more or less already is. I’m running an unregistered W10 Pro and the “activate license” thing only comes up occasionally.
Yes, they are doing both. The list of entities covered by the DMA dropped today.
This. Current title is misleading.
God bless EU
Nah thanks, we’re lucky to be mostly secular.
You can have both. For instance Denmark is among the least religious countries in the world, and at the same time among of the most blessed.
That’s a fine arrangement we’ve got IMO.
Most blessed how? It sucks here.
Most blessed how?
High living standard, low on threats like naturtal disasters and plenty food including Bacon and Beer. Low crime, high on all kinds of life quality/satisfaction indexes that I know of, among the lowest on corruption and poverty. One of the highest ranking on democracy and freedom of speech.
It sucks here.
Maybe for you, for the majority obviously not.
People only like it here because they are mindless drones that blindly worship the system and hold the opinions that the government wants them to. It’s lame.
it sucks more everywhere else
Microsoft Edge is the true religion
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now do the rest of the world.
Is it just me, or does the EU legislators actually care about their citizens?
Any EU citizens that can confirm?
It’s not perfect by any means, but I’m glad to have it and can’t think of any other political organisation doing more “good”.
The ratio of helpful/shit behavior is not great, but we do have both.
In a case like this, I think they’re mainly worried that the dominance of [insert company] from [insert country] is getting too big.
But they was slapping apple for usb C too. They’re doing something right over there.
EU does seem to be on the forefront when it comes to user rights. It’s always nice to see them not just grazing over the issues
Username checks out with that pun.
The huge difference between FTC and EC in terms of the mandate of their operation. Whereas the Sherman Law and FTC are operating with aim to protect customers’ rights or something like that, EC anti-monopoly law is oriented just on that: fighting anti-competitive behaviour. The problem is IMHO that “customer rights” is so flexible term, that (with good support in the campaign contributions, I am sure) it is easy to persuade FTC that almost anything you do is perfectly nice. EC’s anti-monopoly mandate is on the other hand rather strict and inflexible.
Especially when you hire a former Verizon lawyer as head of the FTC, and they do their best to dismantle it from the inside, and then the next person you hire needs to spend a bunch of their time rebuilding what was torn down.
confirmed
That’s nice for the EU folks, elsewhere Microsoft has doubled down on this practice.
If I were on a court or jury, I would rule that repeatedly showing an annoying pop up until you press Agree, doesn’t count as actual acceptance of the terms, I don’t care what the rules are but fuck that practice.
I’ve just doubled down on not using Microsoft tbh. I shouldn’t have to spend so much time and effort cleaning a clean install of an OS. And have updates change things so they don’t work the same or at all any more, or you just can’t find them. Fuck that.
Didn’t this all get decided legally like two decades ago when Microsoft tried to do the same kind of thing with internet Explorer?
What setting can I put in to make Windows think its in the EU?
I have the hilarious image in my head that Microsoft checks their stats and has more EU users than the EU has population.
That’s already pretty likely, given multiple devices per person.
Doubt it, computer sales have been shrinking in the past years. Phone/tablet is often all people need/want.
Don’t forget work computers!
That’s pretty close to 1 Windows PC per office worker. I still don’t think it adds up to a number bigger than European population. There are many people who basically don’t know how to use a computer.
lmfao.
This may or may not help you, I don’t have a Windows 11 install to try: https://www.elevenforum.com/t/change-country-or-region-geographic-location-geoid-in-windows-11.4034/
how to move out of america for free
pay and find a job, profit
In America, software owns you
Pretty sure USA has it the worst when it comes to MS shennenigans.
We get fucked on consumer protections in general.
That is why third party add-ons have become required for usability since Win8. Classic shell or Startallback removes all the bullshit “improvements” and makes the system work smoothly.
The only issue I run into is the occasional “Use Edge” bullshit they push out. It’s more of an annoyance than anything else.
MS is not the only one with the shenanigans. Every tech company is pushing garbage on their customers.
I swear I spend way too much time disabling the shit that the companies want me to use, so I can use the stuff I do.
I disagree, I haven’t had to use any third party-add ons in Windows 10. And once Win 11 brings back the option to not minimise my task bar buttons I think I’ll be happy to switch. It was dumb to remove so many options in the first place though.
Not even MS alone, it seems that my American colleagues are vendor locked in several different ways. It’s a bit bewildering honestly.
Yep. I remember some of my coworkers used to laugh at me saying “What bloatware? I don’t have any, nor the ads. We’ve used the same images, so it must’ve been something you’ve done yourself”.
Turns out that’s because I chose en/us during installation process and our region didn’t have preinstall deals… yet. Now, they too can enjoy self-installing candy crush and literal KGB spyware.
When you don’t control your software, your software controls you, or something like that
Goddammit, now I’m even more disappointed in the UK doing a Brexit…
Too late, I already shoved Linux Mint into my new gaming laptop and I’m glad I felt forced to do it, I’m having my first serious dive into Linux and I’m thrilled about my newfound project! I was so surprised over how very little knowledge you needed to have games running these days.
If you are having battery life problems like I was I would recomend using powertop or tlp
Thanks, it feels much better already, I will check it out!
Ha I did the same and jumped to mint also. Windows got so damn laggy such a shitty OS.
Now do cross-platform messaging next!
According to Microsoft almost everything from Microsoft is cross platform, because it works in both Windows 10 and 11. That’s good enough for Microsoft to be cross platform. I’m not even kidding!
EU: “That still only counts as one”
OK. 😀
Guys. This fellow here is missing a Lord of the Rings reference! Did you know that trilogy is 20 years ago now? Feeling old yet?
Lord of the Rings is from 1968, and I read it in the 80’s, and have seen the movies.
I don’t see how that was a reference to either.
It’s a movie reference. Specifically it references “The Lord of the Rings: The return of the King” at the end of the battle of Minas Tirith. It is said by Gimli, as a response to Legolas slaying a Mumak (giant war elephant).
I’m sorry i don’t have a timestamp.
Edit: It’s 2:50:49ish in the extended edition
OK I looked it up, and that is indeed a LOTR reference.
I just don’t get why people would make a reference out of anything as generic as that?
I mean they can require it if they want. Apple would just bury the fact that it exists and would use something that’s known to be shit. Idk how they could be forced to make iMessage cross platform.
Here we go again, MS already lost a US federal lawsuit for the same thing but with Internet Explorer.
Sadly, they didn’t lose. They almost lost, appealed and ended up with a settlement which didn’t require removing IE from Windows or prevent tying other software to windows.
On November 2, 2001, the DOJ reached an agreement with Microsoft to settle the case. The proposed settlement required Microsoft to share its application programming interfaces with third-party companies and appoint a panel of three people who would have full access to Microsoft’s systems, records, and source code for five years in order to ensure compliance.[29] However, the DOJ did not require Microsoft to change any of its code nor did it prevent Microsoft from tying other software with Windows in the future.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_v._Microsoft_Corp
Yeah I definitely remember that in the news as a teenager…and then I remember everybody kinda shrugged their shoulders and forgot. And now Bill Gates = zoomer jesus after 20 years of PR work to turn his image around.
Somehow, everybody forgot all the dumpster-diving Gates did to “build” Microsoft in the first place.
Crazy to think that Commodore’s BASIC was coded by Bill Gates, though. I was recently reading a programming article he wrote in Compute! magazine back in 1984, when MS ascendance was anything but guaranteed.
Round and round and round.
It’s the same all over again. MS got a slap on their wrists with the browser choice tool they had to introduce in Windows 7.
Then everyone forgot about it and they started forcing Edge on users. Now they get a slap on their wrist again and the same will happen in another 10 years.
Don’t get me wrong, it’s really awesome and I’m glad that EU regulations actually have a impact. But I still wish for more, more permanent and stricter anti monopoly laws.
They won’t get anything much harder than a wrist slap because Edge is not the dominant browser right now. Google just had a much hasher punishment with Android and Chrome
Too late. I work with Microsoft professionally, but I’m about to install Linux Mint privately.
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Linux ate Microsoft’s lunch in the server space. Sometimes the winds shift.
Business decisions are almost always influenced by the personal preferences of people in charge. While OP probably can’t change the existing infrastructure right now, when the infrastructure is eventually changed, OP’s pro-Linux input could make a big difference.
Right, but like, they work with Microsoft professionally, but run Linux personally.
Im a new convert, but it’s weird to me how people try and explain how this thing, that currently exists, is somehow a bad choice. Like I don’t know, maybe I do or do not wind up with more of my professional stuff being on my Linux box, but I don’t really care. It doesn’t bother me that Microsoft exists, I’m just happy Linux does. Microsoft can do whatever the hell it wants.
What a problem to have when your engineering team’s skill set are vendor locked. Not that I’m familiar with autodesk or why you absolutely have to use it, but your engineers could perhaps learn to use blender and use a Linux desktop environment and potentially save a lot of money in licenses and subscriptions.
If it’s 3dsMax yes you can switch over, if Blender doesn’t suffice there’s Houdini and many many 3d graphics studios are in fact Linux shops – Linux inherited that particular slice of the market from IRIX. Some seats will still be on windows or more likely Mac because ZBrush, AfterEffects and generally Adobe. If you’re using Maya there’s no issue in the first place as the thing runs on Linux.
If it’s AutoCAD, though, tough fucking luck. Once upon a time there was Siemens NX but they pulled Linux support and free CAD/CAM is nowhere close to production ready.
And, no, retraining people generally is usually not cheaper than paying license fees, by a long shot. Maybe if you pay out of your nose for Houdini but actually only need Blender but who does that in the first place.
And, no, retraining people generally is usually not cheaper than paying license fees, by a long shot.
Are you speaking of just short-term, or long-term as well?
Long-term for the likes of Hollywood contract studios is “till the end of the production” so, yes. It’s also insanity to switch software while a project is ongoing so you’d have to shut down the studio and then start it up again at which point they’d likely be bankrupt. They’re not even upgrading software versions.
Now if you’re the likes of Siemens or Airbus who more or less on a whim write their own CAD/CAM packages sure it pays off to re-train your engineers, using a software that was tailor-made for what they need to do was the objective in the first place, increasing their productivity. But you won’t make a Maya artist more productive by sitting them in front of Blender. It’s more like switching between vi and emacs: Both are very capable and have steep learning curves due to their sheer power and productivity focus (and one of each causes RSI. To wit, Maya doesn’t have right-click select).
So if I’m to believe you then no one should ever retrain for any better products ever, because it’s too cost prohibitive?
That we should use a static set in cement set of products until the end of time, even if a better ones come out that require training?
Nah there’s definitely another option and that’s to abolish capitalism.
Did you know that with the automation tech from 10 years ago the world could already have 70% unemployed and yet produce western middle-class living standards for absolutely everyone? The reason it’s not done is not that investing in automation doesn’t have a gigantic ROI, it’s that it’s too long-term for capital to care. Also we don’t want that kind of power in the hands of capitalists anyway but that’s another story. The Diamond Age it’s called, I think.
Linux needs to do something that no one else is doing well.
It can’t even do the things that others already do well, much less beyond that.
I use Fedora with KDE, and Steam/ Bottles apps to run the games, and that works great.
Not even going down that track, I’ve been messing with Linux for 15yr and happy to say about 2yr ago switched to Linux mint daily driver and not going back. Can do everything I need to:
Work (teams, prospect mail for Outlook, zoom, etc)
Gaming (Steam and Proton make playing 95% games a reality and actually works great surprisingly)
Music Production (Bitwig - truly awesome DAW very comparable to Ableton live - no BS actually is a TRUE contender and great and stable DAW, by far the best ever used in Linux)
Windows 11 can suck it
