One thing I always look at in post-apocalyptic literature is how they treat transportation: notably, are people still driving cars and how long can they do so and under what conditions?
Entering our current oil crunch, I think it’s obvious how fragile the ecosystem around cars are, but just letting the car sit unused and untreated for as little as a month can start to introduce\ problems. The idea that you can just pop into a car that’s been abandoned for 3 years, pull the keys out from behind the visor, and start driving is unrealistic.
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Best: The Postman. We’re back to walking and riding horses.
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Good: The Last of Us, Season 1. People walk or ride horses, when our heroes DO find a working truck, it is treated as the jackpot it is–and I think it even had a spare gas tank in the back to maximize distance traveled to harvest gasoline. Realistically, gas as a fuel for fires would be a valuable enough commodity that it would have been scavenged, but they need to do some traveling and high speed dragons are not available in this genre (Reign of Fire aside).
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Worst: Jericho. Nuclear explosions in the US pretty much wreck everything and despite the town of Jericho being completely isolated, people just drive their pickup trucks around all seasons long without comment. Horses and bicycles are maddeningly present but rarely used. I think the show thought American audiences could accept a premise where the federal government collapses after multiple nuclear strikes, but not where people in Kansas got off oil dependency–that would be too out there.
Something else that’s often ignored in these scenarios is that gasoline is not shelf stable for very long. Without refineries or biofuel, most gasoline would degrade within a year from what I understand.
Most realistic would be horses, bikes, maybe biodiesel converted cars or motorbikes and a biodiesel creation setup. I could also see electric vehicles with solar or constructed wind/water wheel power to charge batteries. But batteries of course degrade as well so that isn’t a long term solution unless you can make and repair batteries. Which is a stretch.
I think gasoline used to be more stable, but in 2007 the US gave in to the corn lobby and started adding corn ethanol to gasoline, which does limit shelf life. That’s right, in the United States we take food and give it to our cars.
Motorbikes + biodiesel is probably as far as I´d be willing to go, but we’re well back on the path to civilization at that point. You can kickstart a bike without a battery, too…
Looks like you’re right about ethanol affecting shelf life, but it goes from 3-6 months to around 12 months. So still an issue in longer term apocalypse worlds
https://universaltrades.co/blog/gasoline-shelf-life-guide-en/
Also, I don’t think setting up a small scale biodiesel plant would be out of the question for a large enough sect of sufficiently educated humans in an apocayse setting. But it’s definitely a step above something that a small homestead could reasonably expect to setup imo.
I think bikes are also not very good since they need maintenance and parts, and it will be very hard to find those and they won’t be produced anymore.
Nah, bike parts last a long time and are relatively simple to fix or even make (as long as you’re not talking about some dentist’s $10k carbon road bike). My main (non-electric) bike is from the early '90s and is still on most of its original parts, except for stuff like tires, brake pads, and the chain.
Also, bikes have existed for 200 years, which means they predate things like, say, the assembly line. I’m pretty confident that even in a post-apocalyptic scenario you could scrape together enough of a supply line and basic tools to build them from salvaged raw materials.
Probably bikes and walking honestly.
I play cdda. The map generation can be wonky but there can issue of roads overrun by either zombies or abandoned cars. Cars become super useless when you have 1 mile stretch of road you can use untill you clear out the roads.
Also detail that if you run over zombies the bones(or even random crap in pockets) can pierce the tires or wear down the tires.
Horses can be useful but I never use them in game because bikes are more accessible. You could use horses to attract zombies (off roads or into ditches).
The most useful thing horse would be the manure since cars and bikes can’t produce that.
Sorry it didn’t answer your question but wanted to share that
Side note. People can make biodiseal from fast food oil for cheap and animal fat, I highly doubt farmers or truck drivers could get the quantities need
The Road by Cormac Mccarthy. It’s a book and a movie but I have never seen the film. Basically the main character moves his belongings around in a shopping cart with a mirror mounted to it to watch the road behind him. He also keeps a backpack on at all times with essential supplies incase he has to abandon the cart and run.
I thought Station Eleven was pretty good about it, small vehicles / motorcycles for a while, then bicycles and horses + wagons, plus a lot of walking. That was a wildly different scenario though (99.9% of the population poofed in a few day period), so there were a ton of abandoned resources for any survivors.
One bit of fiction that gets it pretty right is (brace yourself): The Onion. This video is a masterclass of world building and rammed solid with blink-and-youll-miss-it gags and sleights, including mentioning arduous, multi-day journeys by barge. It’s like a cross between the Postman, Mad Max and, well, The Onion.
I think you’d see more bikes. A lot less upkeep than a horse, you can find them relatively easy, and they can sit in a garage for months or years and only need some minor maintenance to get going again.
Edit: I can’t think of any books I’ve read recently that depicts primarily bike based transportation though. Probably because it doesn’t look super cool lol
the most realistic thing I can think of is greasel conversion of diesels but I have never seen it done in a show. Then you just need farming of vegetable oil. Batteries though become problamatic after 10 years.
Worst, Honorable Mention: I didn’t watch past Season 2, but I understand the Walking Dead was product-placing current model cars every new season.
Anecdotally, diesels can sit for a long time and be just fine. I suspect there’s something a mechanic could do with an abandoned gasoline car as well. The limiting factor, if we’re talking full collapse of civilisation, is refined petroleum.
During the world wars, there were people converting IC engines to run off of wood gasifiers. For that, you either need the skills and tools to reprogram engine timings, or a carburator, though. Diesels can run on vegetable oil, and EVs can run off a solar panel, or, if still running, a wind turbine.
Horses aren’t cheap or free to run, either. No matter what, there will be less vehicles, the ones that do exists will tend to be heavily loaded to save money (like you sometimes see in the third world) and they’re going to take longer to get where they’re going.
Horses can run off grass.
Which isn’t anywhere near infinite. Humans also run off of grass (wheat, oats, barely, rice…), in most traditional societies.
You’re not even saved the trouble of gathering it if there’s a snowy winter to get through. Plus, there’s shoeing and various kinds of other care to factor in.
??? You don’t need infinite grass to feed a horse. It grows. They roam.
Humans need to plant specific species that we can digest, and then process it so that we can digest those parts because we can’t eat the whole thing, and then cook it. We can’t just eat it raw in the field. This is nowhere near the same. I can’t even.
You do know wild horses exist right?
*I think I’m just gonna leave it at that.
Nice mansplaining, city person. I’m from a farming family, and live in a rural area that has all these things.
You need a certain amount of pasture land (and fodder during the winter). If you don’t have enough, the grass runs out - that’s called overgrazing.
(And because I’ve had this kind of argument on Lemmy before, imma point out that the animals you eat probably ate staple crops. On this continent, at least, we grain-finish everything)
We can’t just eat it raw in the field. This is nowhere near the same. I can’t even.
No, you gather it, pull off the seeds, and if you want to avoid a lot of chewing, grind it a bit. I’m sure all ready from your local bakery it seems like magic, but it’s not.
I like you teach me your ways lemmy farmer
I wanna see people wait months with a tiny solar panel trying to charge their ev so they can drive a couple of miles






