I am fine with the basics (e.g. classical vs rock/punk vs pop based on instruments) but there’s loads of other terms that aren’t very intuitive.

What is the difference between “alternate” rock and I guess “regular” rock? What is the difference between rock and punk? What is post-(insert subgenre here, like punk)? What is pop rock (the music subgenre, not the fizzy candy rocks), and how is it different from rock pop? What makes music “progressive”? What on earth are the “blues”? What is the difference between rock, metal, hard metal, heavy metal, etc. aside from an increasing level of angriness and decreasing level of clarity? etc etc

  • 𝕱𝖎𝖗𝖊𝖜𝖎𝖙𝖈𝖍@lemmy.world
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    4 hours ago

    It’s a language so that people can discuss varying levels of nuance with each other. You probably don’t care about the difference between industrial metal and folk metal, but metalheads certainly do. And even that’s a pretty top level example.

    Same goes for every other genre/subgenre. Indie pop and bubble pop can be very different, and just because someone likes one doesn’t mean they’ll like the other.

    There is also a historic factor in all this because genres are always influenced, derived from, or mixed with other genres. Triphop was born this way, as a mix of hiphop, jazz, dub, electronica, and many others

    Tldr: Think of it as painters describing colors

  • zlatiah@lemmy.world
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    5 hours ago

    I’ve actually been looking into how music genres/subgenres are defined for the past few months due to the fact that my favorite genre “doesn’t exist” (I’m not joking someone wrote a research paper on this)

    I think there are research articles on this if one wants to go into details… Like how certain genres separate. Sometimes there are strict definitions (most techno I think are quite well-defined). But practically I think most ppl tend to enjoy ranges of genres that are close to each other… There are also plenty of genre-blend songs too so there’s that

    Also I second for Every Noise At Once, they have some really obscure genres too for detailed comparisons

  • meathorse@lemmy.world
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    6 hours ago

    The labels and categorisation of everything can get tiring, and be utterly useless or confusing for anyone unfamiliar with a particular genre (it all sounds the same!), however these can still be handy when you find a particular sound you like, you can use that to discover other bands with similar sounds or style.

    As bands in that genre experiment and evolve their sound, they may cross, mix it create all new genres that can lead you down a new list of bands to explore - or perhaps it’s not your flavour so you stick with what you like.

    Most hobbies have depth to them like this, I guess music is so variable that we need a thousand ways to describe all the various possibilities.

  • EndlessNightmare@reddthat.com
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    4 hours ago

    I’m an avid music listener and don’t really get it either. The main thing is that I don’t view genres as rigid categories, rather as general descriptions of how music sounds. Bands can have albums or even individual songs that don’t fit the genre of their other albums/songs.

    With metal and all of its sub-genres in particular, sometimes it feels like splitting hairs.

  • Em Adespoton@lemmy.ca
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    7 hours ago

    Think of them not as means of differentiating musical style for you, but as historical ways of explaining how a band or musical movement differed from the norm.

    Take a band like The Beach Boys. In the 70s, what they were doing was alternative rock — that is, they took the dance/music genre of classic rock and roll, and re-imagined how it would sound on a sandy beach at a surf party instead of in a dance hall.

    Enter the 80s, and their music became part of the cultural norm, so they were popular/“pop” music.

    And yet, as a band, they kept adding new techniques and writing new music right into the 2000s, often drifting back out of popular culture while doing so.

    The point of this is, see what the subgenre tells you about the musicians; it isn’t really a useful way to clearly divide musical works themselves into subcategories.

  • Rhynoplaz@lemmy.world
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    12 hours ago

    I don’t think anyone understands ALL of them.

    As you become familiar with a certain style, you notice differences between them. The deeper you dive and the more you listen to, the finer details you can recognize.

    I could probably name at least 25 different genres of rock, and explain how they are different, but styles I’m not familiar with, I can usually only recognize the broadest category. Bluegrass all sounds like bluegrass to me, but an expert could identify 25 different subgenres of it.

  • yesman@lemmy.world
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    11 hours ago

    This is what happens when you pay too much attention to any kind of taxonomy. Even scientific and rigorous taxonomy disintegrates into subjectivity when you look too close.

    The idea of precisely labeling and categorizing things appears to be a human desire imposed upon an uncooperative universe.

    • Diplomjodler@lemmy.world
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      6 hours ago

      In this case, I think it’s not so much human desire but the need of music journalists to fill column inches.

  • MurrayL@lemmy.world
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    12 hours ago

    It sounds like you want a clear set of rules as to what defines every possible genre of music, which does not and cannot exist.

    Genres only exist for the purpose of subjective comparison. Anyone can create them by taking some elements common to several pieces of music and labelling that as a genre. There’s no master list or governing body that decides exactly what constitutes ‘art rock’. It just is.

    Use them as labels if you find it useful to make a distinction that they allow for. If you don’t see the difference between death metal and heavy metal, great - you don’t need to.

  • dhork@lemmy.world
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    12 hours ago

    Some genres have more commonality than others. Blues songs often have a similar 12-bar structure, for instance. Not all Blues songs, of course, but there are some songs you can listen to and quickly identify it as Blues based on the structure. This structure exists to improvise on top of. Jazz has a lot of improvisation built into it too.

    I also think genres in the past were based on which radio stations they were played on, back when radio was the main way to hear new music. “Pop” music simply meant “popular”, was meant to be more broadly acessible, and was played on Top 40 stations. Whatever counts as “pop” changes with the times. Now, while the distinctions still exist, I don’t think most young people get their music from the radio anymore, so the genres ar not to rigidly defined.

    What I think it comes down to is that bands identify themselves based on whatever they listened to, and what influenced them. So the best way to know what genre a band plays is to ask them.

  • wolfrasin@lemmy.today
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    12 hours ago

    It come down to this: what is the sound pallet and what is the beat pattern?

    A jig is different from a reel or a waltz

    Neuro Funk is different from trap house.

  • rumschlumpel@feddit.org
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    12 hours ago

    They tend to be distinct styles, similar to how bands within a genre can sound really different to each other. Now imagine that a couple of other bands says that one band’s style is the bee’s knees and start doing similar music.

    It does get a bit too opaque and subtle at times, but I still think it’s usually helpful. e.g. “increasing level of angriness and decreasing level of clarity” is a big deal, many people don’t like listening to the extremely aggressive/unclear stuff and thus might say something like “I don’t like death metal, but power metal is great”. Even a Death Metal fan might think Grindcore is too much, etc.

    And it’s pretty annoying when two things that should be different genres commonly get lumped together, like the early 2000s UK dubstep that was really bass-heavy, and Skrillex’ chaotic robot noises.

  • ACourtesanOfArabia@lemmy.world
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    13 hours ago

    Some people really love labels and defining things clearly can be helpful in certain conversations. Personally I mainly listen to K-Pop which incorporates a bunch of genres and influences, so I think some genres are more like umbrella terms than anything.

      • ACourtesanOfArabia@lemmy.world
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        10 hours ago

        I mean the examples you’ve given all have a bunch of sub genres. K-Pop can sound like common pop, rap, indie, R&B, etc. In my mind that makes them umbrella terms.

          • ACourtesanOfArabia@lemmy.world
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            10 hours ago

            Umbrella term is by definition something that acts as a general category, allowing for broader discussion before diving into the unique specifics of each sub-category - which is essentially what a “genre” is. The question was what do all the sub genres of music mean. My answer was that they’re specific labels which are useful in certain discussions/contexts (music criticism, academia, technical enthusiasts), but they don’t necessarily matter in day to day ordinary life, since the umbrella terms are more than enough.

            • zelifcam@lemmy.world
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              10 hours ago

              You are answering a question no one is asking. OP specifically talking about what makes genres and sub-genres different. No one is confusing Muddy Waters with Britney Spears. Which is why they are labeled differently.

  • fyrilsol@kbin.melroy.org
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    9 hours ago

    A lot of subgenres are entirely made up.

    What makes Speed Metal different than Thrash Metal? They sound the same. What makes Death Metal different than Black Metal? They sound the same.

    It is just ways for people to sound very technical for no reason other than to pretend they’re so different.

    • serpineslair@lemmy.world
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      7 hours ago

      They sound the same to you. While I agree that gatekeeping and snobbish "whell achtually"s are just pointless and annoying, they are still useful to people experienced within those genres to identify common styles and just as a fast and efficient way of describing the piece. The genres definitely have their purpose. If they have no use to you personally, don’t use them, that is fine, and you shouldn’t be criticised for that.

    • rumschlumpel@feddit.org
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      9 hours ago

      What makes Death Metal different than Black Metal? They sound the same.

      Nah. I’m not even a big metal fan and unless a band is blending the genres (“blackened death” etc.) they’re pretty distinct, the vocal style in particular should be pretty easy to tell apart. As a rule of thumb, Black Metal vocalists croak, Death Metal vocalists growl.

      • Tujio@lemmy.world
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        7 hours ago

        As a metalhead, metal subgenres are fucking exhausting. I don’t know how to describe bands I like without sounding like a fucking douche.