As the title says, how often do you admit you’re wrong? Is it different when it’s a factual dispute versus something more subjective?
I make an effort to concede early if I’m in error. I think because my mother almost never admits fault. She’ll fall back to “that’s not what I meant” or similar deflections first, and that’s really annoying.
The last big factual error I made was about the distance of walking, and that’s where I learned about Taxicab Geometry ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxicab_geometry ).
I think some people believe admitting fault is a sign of weakness, but I find it’s more of a power move. It takes strength to do it, and people can tell when you’re sweating and desperate. Usually it leads to resolving the conflict faster and cheaper, too.
(I expect some people will feel the urge to reply they’re never wrong. I’ll file that under never admits fault.)
All the time. People tend not to take it well but that seems their problem.
Also it’s one of the things destroying politics.
Also it’s one of the things destroying politics.
That’s often the previous stop on this train of thought. There are maga people that in their secret heart know they’ve made a mistake, but they struggle to come to terms with that. Though that also carries the fear of losing all their social bonds and being rejected by the group.
Exactly, it’s two sided trained behavior. On one side, no guilt is admitted leading to all downsides of never learning and on the other side there’s a ruthless expectation. It can never work.
I try to express my wrongness in a casual way in front of my child or children in general. I aim for them to take away that it’s not a big deal and there is no big stakes in always being right. And if I am right I try to argue facts and attempt to leave personal stakes out of it.
often. usually, when it’s something I misjudged. there’s no shame in it - I had x information, I thought it would be a good idea to do y. I forgot to consider z. can’t win 'em all. or yep I screwed I up I did these calculations / tasks wrong because I was rushing.
it’s harder when it’s an “oh shit yeah I was out of line” thing, but I do it whenever I can because I genuinely want to know if I acted appropriately or not
I will always own up to being wrong if I agree that I was wrong. I will be an absolute pain in your ass if I think I’m being blamed for something that’s unfair/untrue.
I tell people I hate being wrong, so the sooner I am corrected or can correct myself the better.
And the answer is… whenever I’m wrong. I am fairly diligent about thinking through what I say and do, but everybody makes mistakes or lacks knowledge, so I am quick to admit being wrong when I am.
Also, counterintuitively, quickly and casually admitting to being wrong often serves to make people forget you were wrong in the first place. My wife and I have had conversations where she admits being wrong (after entirely too much argument), and comments about how I’m never wrong. And I tell her I’m wrong all the time, I just admit it quickly instead of making a big deal about it, so it’s not very memorable. (As we’ve gotten older, those conversations have become more rare, but she still had me 3D print a medal and trophy wall mount, where she gets a “You Were Right” medal or a trophy each time she’s right… like when she convinced me to take my vomiting dog to the vet at night on a weekend and saved his life, and ended up with a dachshund trophy for her wall)
Every time someone is able to convince me I’m wrong, which is not hard to do, I tend to consider things logically, so empirical evidence that I’m wrong will make me flip immediately. Unfortunately most people use very flawed arguments like trying to appeal to emotions or strawmaning my point (or one of the many fallacious things we all have to deal online). And that will not convince me, in fact it only proves you have absolutely no argument. Which is very unfortunate because I’m wrong quite often, and it only takes one person pointing at actual evidence that I’m wrong to make me realize that, yet the majority of my disagreements online end up at an impasse with the person refusing to find common ground to build the debate up.
Unfortunately most people use very flawed arguments like trying to appeal to emotions or strawmaning my point (or one of the many fallacious things we all have to deal online). And that will not convince me, in fact it only proves you have absolutely no argument
One thing I struggle to remember sometimes is someone can make a bad argument, but what they’re arguing for can still be true.
I used to work with a guy that would argue with me, and sometimes at the end he’d be like “I actually agree with your point, but I wanted you to be right for solid reasons”
Of course, it’s also very common for people to be making bad arguments because they’re just feeling stuff, and they’re pulling together whatever words come close to capturing that right now.
Yes, bad arguments can be made about true statements, but people need to understand that you won’t convince anyone with bad arguments, and that discrediting an argument is not the same as discrediting the statement or attacking the person who made it.
For example, just the other day there was a thread about how pitbulls are supposedly more aggressive than other breeds, but the argument they used was “they’re a minority of the population, yet cause the majority of fatalities, therefore they’re aggressive”, which is a TERRIBLE argument that discards all other possible explanations for the observed statistics. It may be true that pitbulls are more aggressive than other dogs, but that argument will never convince me as it’s just plain wrong. And pointing out just how absurd the argument is brought up a bunch of angry people asserting pitbulls are aggressive and attacking me personally for discrediting the logic.
I used to work with a guy that would argue with me, and sometimes at the end he’d be like “I actually agree with your point, but I wanted you to be right for solid reasons”
Yeah, I do that as well, I call it playing devil’s advocate, it’s helpful to be sure the decisions you’re reaching are actually the best ones.
One of the best interview questions rarely asked. I hate working with people who have to always be right.
When I am wrong and there is evidence?
It makes sense to me, because you learned something.
I actually usually admit if I’m wrong, but I think I don’t if it’s a thing where it’s obvious I was wrong and the other party is holding it over my head. It’s a character flaw but also I don’t really know how to deal with that situation because admitting I’m wrong to a person doing that, in my mind, gives them permission to blame me for anything else adjacent to the situation, which is usually unfair.
I understand you, but try to see it from a different perspective: by admitting your error you are in fact taking their ammunition away! Continue on and if they try to bring it up again and again you can ask them why they can’t move on, do they have a problem?
I appreciate that suggestion. That is probably the exact way for me to think of it. Now if I can break this pattern…
It’s comments like yours that give me faith in Lemmy honestly. They do a lot to cancel out the judgy and angry ones.
My mother never admitted that she was wrong. I don’t want to be like that to my kids or any one else.
I can get defensive, but with some after thought I will admit I was wrong.
When I’m wrong … I admit I’m wrong. No shame in being wrong about something.
As often as I am actually wrong.
Tap for spoiler
Which of course is NEVER!
I can’t think of a single time someone has admitted to having been wrong about something and me thinking less of them because it. It’s always the opposite yet it’s still so painful being in that spot yourself.
I was talking about this with someone a while ago and they suggested that some people’s lived experiences have been more… abusive. Like as a child if they made a mistake their parents treated them like shit. Now they have that untreated trauma deep in their personality. When they make a mistake like making a reservation at the wrong time, they subconsciously think it’s going to be like when their dad screamed at them, smacked them, and sent them to bed without dinner. So they lie and prevaricate to avoid that.
I don’t know how often that kind of early childhood trauma is the root of the behavior, but if that is happening that’s really sad.
I have my suspicions that my ex is like this because of bad parenting.
When my baby nephew tries to stack his stacking rings, my family praises him even if he has the order wrong. It’s how babies learn.
I suspect that people who can’t admit when they’re wrong had parents who told them not to do a task unless they could do it right the first time
Never had someone with a martyr complex “admit to being wrong” about something completely inconsequential or stupid? If so, I envy you.
wrong? what does that mean?
narcissist do that, they wont admit, and will just double down.
Once I realize it I will admit it. I kind of like it because it opens up a little spot in my head that’s eager to be filled with better information.
