Take any tech bro take on transit, and if you try to perfect it, you’ll almost always end up with a train.
How many times will techbros reinvent the train/tram until North America finally starts laying down rails?
The US has so much tarmac they don’t even need rails just turn some of that tarmac into dedicated bus lanes. And put one of these long boys on them
I love this Adam Something classic where they keep optimizing the tech bro idea until it turns into Thomas the Engine
Don’t even need to lay down rails. The rails are already there. Built by Chinese slave labor 150 years ago. We need merely to seize them.
Or just cut a check to the freight companies.
Many cities paved over their tram lines. Sometimes they poke through during road work. We had trams in nearly every city 100 years ago yet today people tell me we can’t afford it or our population is too small to support it. If we could do it 100 years ago we could certainly do it now.
I’d be very concerned about the state and safety of those rails.
Amtrak currently runs trains on the freight tracks, but as Amtrak essentially leases the privilege of using the tracks at all from CSX and BNSF and Union Pacific and the like, their traffic gets heavily deprioritized to freight trains. You can totally catch a train from Fort Worth to Los Angeles, but it will take a few days longer than driving, will be almost as expensive as flying, and the train will be delayed many times for freight traffic.
If the federal government nationalized the rails, put them under the care of the FRA, properly funded Amtrak, and gave it a healthy advertising budget to let people know rail is the clear choice for medium length trips (like Chicago to St. Louis), there’s no reason we couldn’t send passengers on the same rails and with the same priority as freight trains. They’re perfectly safe, and the reason we’ve been hearing about so many train wrecks lately is the degradation of work conditions for rail workers. Longer trains and longer hours make for more dangerous operating conditions and more frequent wrecks.
And while the trains wouldn’t run 190 miles an hour, many long, straight stretches do exist, and it’s not unheard of for a train to be running 80-100 miles an hour on those stretches. That kind of speed is very doable for passenger rail. Hell, some Amtrak trains are capable of 150 miles an hour.
My point wasn’t to use 150 year old rails. It’s that the rails already exist so it doesn’t need to be a decades-long multi-trillion dollar project. It’s highly unlikely that any of the rails in use today are from the 19th century.
On account of the election, you can basically be sure that passenger rail will not happen to any extent any time soon. Expect bigger cars and more highways instead, as this is what is outlined in Project 2025.
Incredibly bleak.
Going backwards while the rest of the world builds more functional and fair cities. We feel just as bad up here in Canada where our provincial premier is overstepping cities to force them to remove bike lanes that just got installed. The lanes are along a subway corridor and there are several apartment buildings planned on those roads that have extensive bicycle parking plans with much less car parking. And we’ve got big plans for new highways while we refuse to build rail along the densest part of our nation.
Building railway tracks to achieve universal coverage for the entire US without be a massive undertaking that would require a huge effort over multiple decades. Compared to that, building self driving cars is downright trivial. Let’s not forget that they exist already, albeit in limited areas. People should not let their (justified) anger at Musk blind them to reality.
Building roadways to achieve the current coverage for the entire US was a massive undertaking that required a huge effort over multiple decades. Compared to that, building railways is downright trivial. Let’s not forget that self driving trains already exist, but self driving cars don’t. People should not let their status quo bias blind them to reality.
Yeah, but the roadways are here now. And this discussion is moot anyway. Trains aren’t happening. Self driving cars are maybe happening.
You wouldn’t need to maintain as many roads if you converted some percentage to rail (which is much cheaper to maintain) so it could be an investment
Musk’s crap can’t even operate autonomously. Waymo and Zoox are on the lead now.
That was my point.
Can’t we just do like, lines on the road that have specific meanings? We could put it all in a book of rules and standards? Make it a nation wide system?
For an international system, the EU has taken some measures to try and make the road markings and such easier for self-driving cars to recognize and whatnot.
At the request of the European Council, the European Commission has introduced that road markings and traffic signs shall be designed and maintained in such a way that they can be properly recognized both by human drivers and by autonomous vehicles.
If tomorrow we banned non-self-driving (NSD) cars, sure. But in most countries, grandfathering in old cars is going to happen for a while. Which means that self-driving and non-self-driving cars will have to share the road.
I could see some transitions possibly. For example, on a 4-lane highway: “In 2027, lane 1 will be separated by a barrier and only allow SD cars. Lanes 2-4 will be for NSD cars only. In 2029, lanes 1-2 for SD. By 2033, NSD cars will be banned on this highway.”
Didn’t Elmo muskrats tunnel end up causing more traffic?
Trains don’t self-drive, though.
But do you know how easy it is to have self driving train compared to self driving car? Because trains only need speed control. Honestly trains are already almost self driving and only needs human inputs occasionally.
You’d think so. But at least Germany struggles massively with missing personnel to staff trains (which includes roles beyond the driver). As far as I know there is no automated solution on the horizon for any form or scale of train traffic. The only self driving trains I have experienced require tight control of the rail environment (entirely underground or lifted above the surface) and special stations with airlocks.
Maybe there is just more money in self-driving cars. But I’m pretty sure they will happen before wide spread automated trains. Which sucks.
Yeah I think it’s the money issue. The companies have more money making self driving cars. Specially since the incremental advancements make them more money on every new car sell.
While trains don’t have incremental advancements with sells associated with them. They have less training and incentives. But technology wise it is definitely easier to control speed 1D, while mostly looking at the front (maybe back) compared to the degree of control/sensors cars need.
Someone has never been to most airports. Or Disney World.
That’s not most trains. Those are highly specialized and constrained applications. There are already self-driving taxis in certain defined city areas, so they’re still ahead by that standard.
I was in Barcelona last month and the metro was automated. Some trams in Switzerland too when I was there two months ago
I’m not a city person but I assumed that was just normal now.
Dunno if you’re from NA but if so just remember you might be a decade behind on public transport
DLR trains do, and several airport trains.
Some London Underground lines have drivers that only intervene in the automatic operation of the train in an emergency or abnormal condition.
So bike lanes but for cars. What could go wrong.
