A big part of it is the view that the left “gives money away”. Union jobs are typically labor with long hous and their view is that “I work hard for the money I eared and my taxes go to the lazy”.
I think that’s bullshit obviously, but that is a pretty common sentiment from my experience.
It’s a really hard mindset to break because at it’s surface it make sense. Especially when you focus on fringe cases.
Like I am sure there are people who abuse the system, but it’s not a good life, they don’t make that much off of it. No one is living large off welfare. The “welfare queen” stereotype had been by and large disproven, but has left a lasting effect on people’s opinion.
Personally I rather have a few $ slip through and make sure kids arn’t starving.
They work long hours but also live in a society. So do they not like roads to drive on? Or having a military? Or public schools? Or libraries? You know. Stuff that benefits them?
You give them way too much credit. They look for negativity and outrage and persecution in everything, not reason and investment and public benefit. To them the biggest danger to the American economy is liberals taking the money from the working folk and giving it to the welfare queens to cover their Lexus leases or whatever.
What’s that you say? The government is taking the middle class’s money to subsidize wealthy people not paying taxes? Why are you so JeaLoUS? Why do you want to PuNiSh SuCcEsS rather than rewarding it, comrade? Now stop trying to give free food to growing children who didn’t earn it you monster!
That’s another reason US tax system baffles me. Why does it make it so that workers have to pay taxes this way. In my country, salary have very small tax and it’s cut before the money comes into your account at all. So whatever money you egt is yours, there is no feeling of paying taxes at all. While employers will pay taxes and the taxes on profit is a lot more than tax on salary.
I personally think there’s not much point of tax on the salary, they’ll be spending it on other things, and whoever makes profit on that will pay the taxes on their profit. e.g. you get salary no tax, you buy clothes, vehicle, prepared food, etc. and those companies get your money, and they pay tax on profit, and then have expenses which is money that goes to other companies/people who again pay tax on profit, and their expenses goes somewhere else. All in the money is only taxed once, when there is profit. Unlike in every transaction.
I have been thinking about this as well. I am sure there is some probelm with a spending side tax rather than income. Probably subversion of the tax. Undertable deals, street vendors, etc. With income they make the company track and get their cut before you are able to subvert anything.
Also our economy is very credit based with the use of credit cards. If taxes were all collected at point of sale there might be probelms with defaulting and who gets the money if people don’t pay.
I am not an economist. I am sure someone has thought of it already.
If I may propose a counterpoint: all that, in some cases, sure, but certainly also other cases where they started out under the umbrella of the right’s airtight propaganda screen and simply never bothered to get a second opinion, reinforced by the cult-like indoctrination claiming that everybody else is lying anyway.
Propaganda works and it takes an active effort, an effort that is severely discouraged by the existing propaganda environment, to seek out a reality check.
However, while such cases may exist, it is getting harder and harder as time goes on to justify sticking to the FOX propaganda bubble at this point.
You are completely right. There’s an entire ecosystem of right wing propaganda channels out there but most people get their news from their friends. It’s the key phenomenon behind influencer culture. And that’s how most of the damage is done.
If someone has one friend who is considered knowledgeable on current affairs and that one friend watches Fox, chances are that none of his associates will have an accurate understanding of any given topic. And that’s by design. The kind of tripe spread on fox news is inflammatory and salacious. The sort of noxious trash you’d share with friends in private conversation.
I realize this is what TikTok and facebook maximize: The friend effect. People learn from their friends. The kind of lies spread by right wing networks is magnified by social media and Russian bot farms.
Union worker myself. I am also baffled by the strong conservative undercurrent in my fellows’ views. Don’t know how they sustain it.
Bigotry, selfishness, severe lack of intelligence and or basic reasoning skills. I can keep going.
A big part of it is the view that the left “gives money away”. Union jobs are typically labor with long hous and their view is that “I work hard for the money I eared and my taxes go to the lazy”.
I think that’s bullshit obviously, but that is a pretty common sentiment from my experience.
Now that you say that, yeah, I do hear that kinda shit from my older and, ironically, youngest coworkers. I’ve given up arguing with them.
Please keep arguing with them
If Trump wins i will need to flee the country for my family’s safety. And i would rather not.
It’s a really hard mindset to break because at it’s surface it make sense. Especially when you focus on fringe cases.
Like I am sure there are people who abuse the system, but it’s not a good life, they don’t make that much off of it. No one is living large off welfare. The “welfare queen” stereotype had been by and large disproven, but has left a lasting effect on people’s opinion.
Personally I rather have a few $ slip through and make sure kids arn’t starving.
They work long hours but also live in a society. So do they not like roads to drive on? Or having a military? Or public schools? Or libraries? You know. Stuff that benefits them?
Not the part they are upset with. This particular example it’s with welfare. Seeing it as people getting money for not working.
A lot of people also don’t understand the benefits taxes provide as you described but not what I am talking about.
You give them way too much credit. They look for negativity and outrage and persecution in everything, not reason and investment and public benefit. To them the biggest danger to the American economy is liberals taking the money from the working folk and giving it to the welfare queens to cover their Lexus leases or whatever.
What’s that you say? The government is taking the middle class’s money to subsidize wealthy people not paying taxes? Why are you so JeaLoUS? Why do you want to PuNiSh SuCcEsS rather than rewarding it, comrade? Now stop trying to give free food to growing children who didn’t earn it you monster!
That’s another reason US tax system baffles me. Why does it make it so that workers have to pay taxes this way. In my country, salary have very small tax and it’s cut before the money comes into your account at all. So whatever money you egt is yours, there is no feeling of paying taxes at all. While employers will pay taxes and the taxes on profit is a lot more than tax on salary.
I personally think there’s not much point of tax on the salary, they’ll be spending it on other things, and whoever makes profit on that will pay the taxes on their profit. e.g. you get salary no tax, you buy clothes, vehicle, prepared food, etc. and those companies get your money, and they pay tax on profit, and then have expenses which is money that goes to other companies/people who again pay tax on profit, and their expenses goes somewhere else. All in the money is only taxed once, when there is profit. Unlike in every transaction.
I have been thinking about this as well. I am sure there is some probelm with a spending side tax rather than income. Probably subversion of the tax. Undertable deals, street vendors, etc. With income they make the company track and get their cut before you are able to subvert anything.
Also our economy is very credit based with the use of credit cards. If taxes were all collected at point of sale there might be probelms with defaulting and who gets the money if people don’t pay.
I am not an economist. I am sure someone has thought of it already.
If I may propose a counterpoint: all that, in some cases, sure, but certainly also other cases where they started out under the umbrella of the right’s airtight propaganda screen and simply never bothered to get a second opinion, reinforced by the cult-like indoctrination claiming that everybody else is lying anyway.
Propaganda works and it takes an active effort, an effort that is severely discouraged by the existing propaganda environment, to seek out a reality check.
However, while such cases may exist, it is getting harder and harder as time goes on to justify sticking to the FOX propaganda bubble at this point.
You are completely right. There’s an entire ecosystem of right wing propaganda channels out there but most people get their news from their friends. It’s the key phenomenon behind influencer culture. And that’s how most of the damage is done.
If someone has one friend who is considered knowledgeable on current affairs and that one friend watches Fox, chances are that none of his associates will have an accurate understanding of any given topic. And that’s by design. The kind of tripe spread on fox news is inflammatory and salacious. The sort of noxious trash you’d share with friends in private conversation.
I realize this is what TikTok and facebook maximize: The friend effect. People learn from their friends. The kind of lies spread by right wing networks is magnified by social media and Russian bot farms.