He can make both those statements. He should absolutely not be comparing them.
The decision to nuke japan was based on factors entirely different than any possible factor to nuke gaza.
In any sane world, senators suggesting dropping war crimes all over another country would be immediately removed
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This is an interpretation of what happened. It’s the one that paints America in the most favourable light, for sure.
Another one is that the “no surrender” mentality was a direct result of the terms of the Potsdam Declaration which demanded “unconditional surrender” from Japan. Japan knew they had lost, they were just hoping to fight for the SPECIFIC surrender condition of the preservation of the Imperial line (aka, let the Emporer still be the Emporer, preserve the family).
Had the Potsdam Declaration permitted that concession, it very well may have been the case that no nukes would have been necessary.
Anyways: tough to understand the exact truth of any hypothetical situation. I just think it’s unfortunate that the “The USA HAD to, though” argument is so often repeated without a very full context of the surrounding political realities. It’s a very bite sized explanation, and it paints the USA in a fantastic light. It’s perhaps not a coincidence that it was AT Potsdam that the west hinted to Stalin of the existence of the nuclear bomb.
What’s the point of building the thing if you can’t prove to the world you have it, and are willing to use it?
Another one is that the “no surrender” mentality was a direct result of the terms of the Potsdam Declaration which demanded “unconditional surrender” from Japan. Japan knew they had lost, they were just hoping to fight for the SPECIFIC surrender condition of the preservation of the Imperial line (aka, let the Emporer still be the Emporer, preserve the family).
It should be pointed out that this is what ended up happening anyway. The emperor stayed in power and lived until like the 90s. So whoopsie daisy on the whole nuke thing
You are leaving out the historical context of hyper violent insane independent action for honor mindset of the soldiers within the Imperial Japanese Army and Navy (IJA/IJN).
This culture of insubordination included a widespread belief that they did not to have obey civilian commands, and is largely responsible for ground level soldiers deciding on their own to kick off the war in Manchuria.
It’s entirely reasonable to envision a counterfactual version where either one of, or both the IJA and IJN refuse to surrender, or even just large contingents within either.
I’m not saying this to invalidate anything you’ve said, but I do think it’s highly relevant context when considering any alternative ways that could have gone.
The nukes were not thrown because of Japan but as a message to the USSR.
Well no, the best hand you could have played would have been to drop them on military targets instead of civilian targets.
Those bombs were war crimes too; we don’t need to invoke some kind of American exceptionalism for a war crime that happened 80 years ago.
Internment camps are also war crime AFAIK. So it seems like the situation is just that the US government did not believe Japanese people were human and decided to do war crimes and human rights violations.
Yes, I agree. WWII had a bunch of war crimes in it. I would rather we learned from them than we tried to justify them.
McNamara says of the firebombing of Japan that LeMay knew it was a war crime.
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Not sure why you chose my comment to reply to. I made no statement on any justification, or otherwise, for attacks on japan.
The fact we are even still having that debate in our modern day surely shows do not fucking nuke gaza
They replied to you with something else, and that was removed. So they are really responding to that.
I’m honestly amazed that account has found a way to get every sub to hate some of their comments
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Let’s drop Lindsey Graham on Gaza instead of a nuke.
Imagine how much better the world would be if there was just a simple process of psychological screening for would-be politicians, and psychopaths were barred from holding office.
There should also be a limit on how stupid they’re allowed to be.
At this rate we’d have no politicians!
Sure sounds better than what we currently have
Smart people put political proxies in power so they can get on with living their life.
There are only two reasons to become a politician and STAY a politician, and Graham is no Sanders.
Colonel Sanders, maybe…
Better screen for sociopaths too.
Casually arguing for breaking the taboo on using nuclear weapons.
Forget Gaza, this is how human civilization ends.
We have been saying that Israel is a moral and legal hazard to the entire world as it rallied its allies to throw out all resemblance of a rule based international order recognizing such basic human rights like not being slaughtered and having access to basic food, water and medicine.
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So is Turkey.
But the guilt for colonialism and belligerent Christianity apparently lies so heavy on Westerners, that they are ready to absolve it with the blood of Christians never involved in those.
It’s an especially disgusting kind of virtue signalling to combine being against Israel, but for Turkey and Azerbaijan.
What are you talking about? Israel and Azerbaijan are allies. Azerbaijan sells its oil and gas to Israel and Israel granted it the “right” to exploit the gas fields in front of Gaza they want to steal. Israel supplied Azerbaijan with drones so it can slaughter Armenians.
And Turkey did not put the UN Charta through a shredder or demanded the world to attack UN institutions. Also Turkey does not demand its allies to cheer it on for its crimes.
I know they are allied, Israel and Turkey are not really that hostile between themselves too.
It’s about how optics of all this work on general Western audiences.
I agree Turkey relies less on such corruption. Azerbaijan is pretty similar to Israel in that regard, though. They just don’t need loud approval when silent approval does the job.
This should disqualify him from ever holding office again. I know it won’t, but it should.
You mean it should lock him behind bars for life.
Ahh yes, dropping nuclear weapons right next door, risking fallout in your own territory and pissing off every country around you, as well as all your allies. Why not?
How dare you question the blinding brilliance that is Lindsey? I’m sure his masterplan accounts for things like inciting a global nuclear war with some clever solution that isn’t just waiting it out in a congressional bunker with all his cowardly friends while we all die horribly, right?
indeed, the bunker has been upgraded to a SpaceX satellite mesh hotel.
Ya know, if post Civil War reconstruction had actually happened and we’d de-confederated the South like we de-nazi’d Germany and Japan the GOP wouldnt exist today.
Well, kinda, since the parties swapped roles in the Southern Strategy as a response to the civil rights movements, back then the democrats were the overtly racist ones. So we could assume the GOP would still exist but it would look nothing like the “modern” (hah) version.
Yes, the nuance of the party swap in the 60s is lost on most people.
Thats how my ultra-maga relatives get to prpudly post on FB how theyre the party of Lincoln and in the very next post proclaim their hatred anything farther left than the taliban.
“We’re the party of Lincoln, that’s why everything needs to be named after a Confederate general. State’s rights.”
“Modern” -> “current”
And we’d probably have actual human rights laws in America, instead of means-tested, drug-tested government aid.
Spelling errors in titles really grind my goat.
Seeing how there aren’t any, that seems to be a non sequitur.
“Discretely” should be “discreetly”. One means “separately” and the other “unobtrusively”.
That’s true. Ten points for Ravenclaw.
You could argue that using the wrong homophone transcends mere misspelling and becomes a different category of error…
Indifference to human life totally on brand for the gop
This is not indifference. This is a call for genocide. And a genocide at Ausschwitz proportions.
I’m saying lindsey graham doesn’t care if people live or if people die.
I’m from in Belgium, and have colleagues from countries from both sides of the second world war. The carpet bombing of cities is still talked about every now and then. It’s still remembered as one of the worst tragedies during that war (apart from the obvious), and the scars it left in many family trees still pain the people to this day.
Hearing stories from Gaza and the Donbas always remind me of the stories I used to hear from my grandfather, and I believed we left those war tactics behind in the last century. It’s absolutely insane hearing an allied country to ours debating using those tactics again.
“I want you to use my words against me. If there’s a Republican president in 2016 and a vacancy occurs in the last year of the first term, you can say Lindsey Graham said let’s let the next president, whoever it might be, make that nomination."
Only thing this guy deserves to hear for the rest of his life.
How is it even legal to call for the murder of so many people using one of the most atrocious weapons humanity has invented…but if one were to suggest to apply a guillotine to this person for doing so, they would be in severe legal trouble?
Same way you can say guillotine the rich but not kill Jeffy Bezos
One is seen as more direct, even though the other includes more people
You can suggest he deserves a lot of things - like you can a pedo. What you can’t do is say you’re going to do it yourself.
I’m shocked! Who could have guessed this slimy invertebrate would have zero regard for anyone but himself!?
It’s wild that if anyone were to suggest killing Lindsey Graham they would probably be arrested and called a terrorist. But he can just casually advocate for nuking a densely populated area that is inhabited mostly by civilians and a bunch of brain dead morons will still vote for him.
The only thing Lindsey likes more then male prostitutes is killing POC. 🐞🐞🐞
Where did they find this absolute muppet? Does he not even know what fallout is?
Grindr, probably. Don’t Google his ladybugs.
What’s that mean? I’m not familiar with the term ladybugs
this is gonna be like santorum isn’t it
Who votes for this monster?
More than half of the people who voted, since he ended up getting elected to the Senate.
On another site I saw someone argue that some Republicans intentionally say outrageous things or introduce inflammatory bills on purpose just to get opposing parties and such to rage over it and then they turn around and use that to their advantage somehow.
