I’m cis. I’m a cis man with a exclusive sexual interest in cis women. I find the term very helpful to express very clearly who I am and what I want. I can’t imagine being so delicate as to lose my shit over being called cis.
I’m cis and my sister is too. My cister, if you will.
Are you a dad?
No, I’m just a bachelor dude. A mister. Or even… a “cister”?
Groan.
Wow guys, get a load of this cissy over here!
(Jk me too lol)
I don’t know why people get so grumpy over the word cis
If a room has no lights on do you say “this room has a complete absence of light”? Or do you say the room is dark?
I find cis to be an extremely useful term. It very clearly conveys what I am and who I’m interested in. Why wouldn’t I embrace it?
It kinda feels like people who don’t believe trans women and cis women are interchangeable should be the ones pushing the word, those who say ‘trans women are women’ surely don’t want the slogan to be made meaningless by having cis women as the established term.
That was the point of my meme.
They’re trying to use it as a slur but it perfectly captures what I’m trying to say and that pisses them off.
More like if the room is lit its “normal.” That seems to be how people see it, being “persecuted” becauae they cant be normal and call others abnormal
becauae
I like that
I find the word as displeasing as some people find ‘moist’, but I’m entitled to an opinion. Am I going to wave a sign around and demonstrate over it despite thinking it was promoted for its potential to upset the victim? Of course not: it’s just a stupid name and I’ve been called far worse by better drill sergeants. There’s a lot of room in there between disliking something and “losing my shit over” it, and it will help respecting others if you understand that.
Well, there’s also a different between “I have a weird visceral reaction to the sound itself” and “I think its equal to the new word” lol
What victim?
Wow, you really are delicate. It’s got to be hard going through life being offended by such little things all the time
That’s a really weird response to someone’s reasonable comment.
You think it’s reasonable to be offended by the words “moist” and “cis”?
People who are offended by being called “cis” are often the same people who have spent their lives labelling everyone else because of a misguided sense of superiority. Being called “cis” bursts that bubble of, “you can’t label me because I one of us, not one of them.” Those people need to get the fuck over themselves.
When someone uses the words f-ggot or d-ke or tr-nny or the words cis or breeder or the N word or bloodmouth or carnist or corpsemuncher or any one of the other words that fanatics or extremists use I know exactly what they are and I stop giving the first fuck about anything they say.
EdIT: Do you know why this comment is being downvoted? It’s because the members of the fanatical groups that I listed in my last paragraph resent being lumped in with the members of the other fanatical groups I listed. Each one of them believes that they are morally pure and supperior and that the others are not. They can’t see that they are making the exact same intellectual error in believing that they are pure and superior and that everything they say and do is justified. Anti-LBGTQ extremists and pro-LGBTQ absolutists are the same. Different beliefs and targets but the intellectual mistake that they make is exactly the same.
They didn’t even say he found it offending. Just that they found it displeasing.
They then spent the rest of the comment talking about how they keep it to themself and doesn’t attack or act otherwise negatively to people who use them. The way a healthy person handles such things.
Meanwhile you’re the one actually flying off the handle and getting offended by this. I would suggest some introspection as to why you’re so bothered by a random comment on the internet like that.
Displeasing…synonym, offensive.
Meanwhile you’re the one actually flying off the handle
Ah…the classic, “I know you are but what am I” retort.
Splended. Back to the school yard, are we?
OC is trying to use reductive fallacious arguments to invalidate my clearly stated preference. I’m not playing that game because that IS offensive.
Might I be a hypocrite? Of course not, it’s the children who are posting.
People who are offended by being called “cis” are often the same people who have spent their lives labelling everyone else because of a misguided sense of superiority.
Citation needed
Citation needed
That is not a citation.
I’ve never met a person who is.
exclusive sexual interest in cis women
Hmm. So in other words, you think you can always tell if someone is trans?
If someone says they’re not interested in dating Republicans, it doesn’t mean they are any better than the average person at picking one out from a crowd.
No, but they didn’t say not date, they said not attracted to.
Attraction can change as you learn more about a person. There’s plenty of people on tinder who looked hot in their pictures but their bio then went on to turn me off.
So you were never attracted to those people?
There was initial attraction but the additional information killed it.
So in other words, you are not defending the statement that the commenter was making, about never experiencing attraction?
Do you consider yourself attracted to AI, cartoons, and or wax figures? Or do withhold judgment until you find out if they are human?
So in this metaphor trans people are AI, cartoons, and wax figures, and cis people are human?
Or, on a less confrontational tact, do you only experience attraction once you’ve confirmed that the person is cis? How does that work, do you ask for medical records before having an initial impression of people?
They didn’t actually use either of those terms.
Can you go back and show me where I said that?
I’m cis. I’m a cis man with a exclusive sexual interest in cis women.
Here. Unless you know for certainty that you can 100 percent correctly identify every person you meet as cis or trans, you wouldn’t have the knowledge to confidently make that statement.
Unless I misunderstand?
I have very clearly stated that I am exclusively interested in cis women. Are you suggesting that a trans person would ignore my very clearly stated preference and lie to me in order to have sex with me?
Hey, maybe instead of leaning on the “trap” meme that gets trans women brutally murdered you can actually engage with the content of what I’m saying.
Are you nitpicking an ally for using “exclusive” instead of “principal”?
MapleEngineer doesn’t actually know for sure that he has never been attracted to a trans woman. So it’s important to correct him when he says he has an exclusive sexual interest in cis-women.
Is that your point? That failing to acknowledge the nuance that sexuality exists on a spectrum must be addressed confrontationally because it’s erasure?
Transphobia and homophobia are too often literally (yes, I mean literally) beaten into men. We have to work to unlearn it. If an ally says he wouldn’t be able to keep it up if he learned the woman he was courting was assigned male at birth, believe him, but don’t discount him as an ally. Imo your efforts are better spent combating active transphobia than policing your allies. If their terminology hurts you, suggest better ways to articulate their points but do it collaboratively instead of confrontationally.
Just my two cents.
If you have issues with my tone maybe you should have raised the issue instead of me, because you obviously know how to do it better.
You can still collaboratively discuss with him why he is incorrect and how he is falling into ambient transmisogyny if you want.
I very clearly stated my preference. You’re trying to use pedantic arguments to invalidate my clearly stated preference. Are you suggesting that I shouldn’t be allowed to have a preference or that people who don’t like that preference or don’t think I should have that preference should be allowed to simply ignore my preference?
I think that your “preference” is based on very sloppy thinking rooted in ambient transphobia. I think you are also confusing a desire for precision of thought with being pedantic.
I think you’re trying to imply that preferences are neutral facts. I think you should consider how you’d react to someone saying “I am only attracted to white women” or “I am only attracted to 18 y/o women”. Do you think their preference is a neutral fact or an expression of something?
Oh, also, expression of “preference” is different than having a preference. Ask why you felt the need to say it in this thread.
Of course. For example, this woman is obviously trans:
I don’t think that MTG is trans but she is utterly unattractive to me physically and she’s a fucking horrible person.
41?
Imagine we joked about cisgender men suicide rates the same way we joke about transgender suicide rates.
Plus this statistic is flawed. It comes from an older study that does not even compare pre- to post- transition.
People who joke like that are disgusting.
I don’t care who you are, if your best option is suicide, we failed you and we should be sorry.
In fact, the American Psychological Association warns that manhood and masculinity are so construed by society’s expectations, that being a man poses mental health risks itself.
There is a whole subdiscipline that focuses on 'counseling men".
Not to mention no one of this lot wants to have this discussion, either online or IRL.
https://www.apa.org/about/policy/boys-men-practice-guidelines.pdf
Who jokes about suicide rates from any group?
I think the Adolf Hitler suicide rate is too low.
I’d say 100% is perfectly fine. He just needs to work on his timing.
In my experience? The people in modmail on trans communities. At least once a week.
That is literally exactly what is happening. MtF transwomen are considered men by haters and hence get the male treatment of crass jokes and lack of support.
Transphobia is the intersection of misandry and toxic masculinity and all of it is gross.
I’ve been playing with this thought for a while, and it’s nice to see someone else express it
TIL ‘41’ has a long history as a slur for homosexuals
https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2021/10/number-41-became-anti-gay-slur-mexico/
Is every word and number going to get colonised as dogwhistle until all of language has become a minefield ? Why do we even give air to this shit ? It seems to me acknowledging it is to give it power and legitimacy.
Kind of like asking if we can stop picking up stones and rocks and using them to beat each other and instead use them to build homes.
This isn’t a new fight. There will always be people who take our tools and abuse them by using them to hurt others. That’s what we’re fighting against, people who use our tools to hurt people instead of doing good. Unfortunately, if we just let people who collect stones and sticks for hurting people be, and not push them out of our village, they will just grow in number and strength so we can’t just block it out, we can’t live and let live around those who would take your life if they grew strong enough.
If it’s tiring and annoying to see people have to always yell at the club-and-rock-wielding thugs and throw rocks back at them, you don’t have to get involved, but don’t decry those who DO have the courage to throw rocks back. If they didn’t do this, the rocks would start hitting you next.
I mean I just watched this explanation of the “sneed seed and feed” dogwhistle and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUbo0IeWTY4 It doesn’t seem to signal more than vague group membership appartenance. I think the thing with dogwhistle is they expire as they diffuse. Like teens drawing swastikas and penises just because it’s offensive. This “41” is from more than a century ago. I think with these heirloom dogwhisles, you at least should check how much they really mean it are if they’re just shitposters. You don’t want the whiteknight stonethrowers to get bogged down by collateral damage, playing into their game and catching all the flak from “them”
They’ve already ruined a perfectly good mustache, forever.
We need a Ted Lasso-like character to neutralize it.
Not a common one, at least not in the US.
in the US it’s an anti trans reference to the % of trans people who had suicidal ideation in one study
I have never heard of it in this context before this post and I live in the us.
It’s actually the number of brain cells lost every time someone reads stupid shit like this on the internet
Just because you have never heard of something doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.
You were one 15 second search away from not being a cunt on the internet but here you are, being proud of how ignorant you are.
People from these groups get pretty well informed about various dogwhistles and slurs that the general population won’t, because they’re used to harass us.
I heard the number 43 is code for marijuanas
watching transphobic cis people piss and shit themselves over being called cis has been one of the funnier things in my modern life.
I’m not trans but don’t understand why I have to accept being called cis.
My gaming friend who’s m-f is a female now, sure, whatever works for her. But why must I suddenly have a name for something I am. I didn’t choose any of this? Is it actually made to anoy me, it doesn’t. Is it something that happens because, in the modern day we live in, this is just a change that has to happen? I don’t know, probably.
What I do know is that the trans community is, in many cases, so unrelentingly hostile towards cis, because many don’t understand. Even against trans people, some communities create so many rules. My friend had trouble trying to fit in because she wasn’t trans enough for her discord group. Wtf?
Bottom line for me is; were all human, and that is more a problem than gender. Jealousy, pride, ego, it’s all part of a human and that goes for cis/trans and the lot.
And I think alot of cis people hate being called that because it’s new and it feels aggressive.
Can’t wait for someone to smack me down for my opinion
don’t understand why I have to accept being called cis.
Because that’s what you are. It’s a statement of fact, not an insult
But why must I suddenly have a name for something I am
Cisgender isn’t a new term. Also, it’s because trans people are actually somewhat accepted now so we need a more mainstream way to reference people who are and are not. Really simple concept
What I do know is that the trans community is, in many cases, so unrelentingly hostile towards cis
LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL. You’re not the victim here, stop it.
Bottom line for me is; were all human, and that is more a problem than gender. Jealousy, pride, ego, it’s all part of a human and that goes for cis/trans and the lot.
Bullshit. If that were true you wouldn’t care about being called cis.
And I think alot of cis people hate being called that because it’s new and it feels aggressive.
It only feels aggressive to those who have been saying sht like “tranny” with bile in their tone, likely because theyre projecting their intentions.
Can’t wait for someone to smack me down for my opinion
Glad I could help out.
Guess you’re right. But the part about the trans community is something I’ve seen happen to my friend, not myself.
They were so unfair. Like you say. They were victims and very bitter about it.
I really cannot care about most of the drama. That’s too time consuming. Old men probably feel threatened, I don’t. Regardless, we will never meet eachother but a discussion keeps the mind fresh, thank you.
You also have to accept being called “white”, but noone gets up in arms about it.
not to be that guy here but I f do not identify as white. I understand I am racialized in my society as white, but whiteness is oppressive, and I reject whiteness. you may call me “Pennsylvanian” though.
You’re a white dude, that’s a fact, you can dress it up as much as you want but that’s the whole point of this post.
I’m aware how others racialize me but it is not part of my identity.
then you should probably identify as some form of mixed then.
“some form of mixed” isn’t my ethnicity. I’m a Pennsylvanian
well technically, you’re some form of American, not Pennsylvanian. Technically, you’re using a demonym which is actually irrelevant to ethnicity.
how dare you tell me my ethnicity doesn’t exist.
I’m not trans but don’t understand why I have to accept being called cis.
Cis is literally just a root term meaning “not trans” I.E. "identifies with gender assigned at birth. I.E. full correlation between sex and gender, biologically (i’m using the interpretation that in trans people, there is a biological desync somewhere along the line, separating physical sex, and mental sex, causing the “trans-ness” to exist, you probably shouldn’t disagree with me, because the research and lived experience behind this stuff supports it)
It’s like me talking about your ethnicity. There is literally nothing you can do to have control over it, it’s a fully observed concept, there is no “applied” conceptualization of the term cis. Just like there is no active conceptualization of the term “human”
My gaming friend who’s m-f is a female now, sure, whatever works for her. But why must I suddenly have a name for something I am. I didn’t choose any of this?
yeah, none of us did, i didn’t fucking want to be born, i didn’t decide to exist, and even if i did, it wasn’t here on this hell hole of a planet. Who gives a shit that people call you cis, because you are literally, objectively cis. You are arguing the most fundamental aspects of philosophy here. You might as well engage in nihilism if this hurts your soul.
Is it actually made to anoy me, it doesn’t.
no, it’s not. It’s not supposed to. It’s a mechanism for classifying your existence in a broader, undefined society, that is experiencing challenges of definition more broadly across the whole of the field this term specifically resides in. In fact, healthcare in general, is experiencing a minor revolution.
if you’re curious about why they exist, have a look into social gender expression, or gender identity more broadly, modern or historical (historical being 1950’s) hell you can even go into ancient human history and see the same thing, though it’s often different from how it is now. There were still clear distinctions in how things worked.
Things change, as they always have, and will continue to change, Change is good, it signals technological evolution, and social progress. There is nothing inherently bad about change. I mean sure there’s bad change. Like hitler, for example. But if hitler didn’t exist, there is no guarantee that we wouldn’t still be fighting like the british were during the revolutionary war.
What I do know is that the trans community is, in many cases, so unrelentingly hostile towards cis, because many don’t understand. Even against trans people, some communities create so many rules. My friend had trouble trying to fit in because she wasn’t trans enough for her discord group. Wtf?
in defense of the internet, you are asking a pretty stupid question. It’s like being mad when someone refers to you by your proper honorific title. It’s just, fucking weird.
and infighting in the queer community is a thing, it’s a big problem as of late, although that’s a different story and nobody really knows how to classify it or what to do about it at this moment.
And I think alot of cis people hate being called that because it’s new and it feels aggressive.
yeah, you’re correct about it being new, people are apprehensive to change. It’s normal, doesn’t mean you need to express it though. Also, it likely feels aggressive to you because you haven’t been classified before in your life time, to this degree at least. Chances are, you don’t like it now, even though you’ve probably done the same thing to other people, and you’ve almost certainly seen this done to other people throughout your life, aware or not. Gay people were considered mentally ill up until the 70’s and it was only really more normalized in the 90’s.
BTW, i recommend you do some reading on the Schizoid personality disorder, and do some thinking about how it feels to be classified. It’s better than being socially shunned, consciously or not.
If you feel like your life is crumbling because you’re being called cis, you might want to think back to what red lining was like, or what the pushback against the gays was like, or what it was like being japanese in the US shortly after pearl harbor, or being muslim in the US any time after 9/11, or jewish, just in general. Or like a minority in an oppressive state/regime.
To sum it up here, you’re complaining about being called cis. It’s not a slur, it’s not an insult, it’s not degrading, it’s just a classification term. And this is apparently, the most important problem in your life right this moment, judging by the fact that you left a comment about it. You’re not worried about putting food on the table, or being sane, or fitting in with society, or being able to function within it, putting gas in your car, getting to work, having work, being able to do your job, and being able to live in general.
It’s a rather privileged problem to have, and you should think about how good your life is, rather than how bad it is.
I think I’m missing something with “41” is it some kind of dog whistle?
41%, or the statistic of how many transgender people have attempted to commit suicide.
Sometimes used as a synonym for suicide.
Of course it’s something horrific like that. Fuck those people. 41 goes on my dog whistle list.
I feel my life is happier not knowing or caring about their dog whistles. Is that harmful to others?
Erm, yea, I’d say so.
If you don’t recognize and call out dogwhistles then it makes it easier for chuds to hide in plain sight. It should not be easy for them. They should not be able to hide. They should be called out, named, shamed, and overall be met with the persecution they wish on marginalized groups that they target.
If you believe in such things, it’s a moral imperative to make their lives more difficult, and knowing their dogwhistles is an important part of that.
Would you share that list?
I don’t want to live on the same planet with anyone who would quote that statistic for any reason other than an emphatic demand for action to lower it
I don’t understand how anyone can think hate is ever the right thing to do.
I think most sane people want to have it lower, the contention comes when we get to how to lower it.
Pardon my ignorance, but what does cis mean?
Like Inside as the outside. Do you feel like a man and were born male, do you feel like a woman and were born female? Then you are cis. It’s the opposite of trans: inside not like the outside.
Ooh, thanks for the insight!
So does that mean one could be Cis and Gay for example? As in feeling like a man and born male, and also attracted to men?Yeah, pretty much. IIUC being trans does not have anything to do with terms for sexual attraction.
Question for the crowd who understands this better, a transwoman attracted to women is still termed a lesbian, right?
Yep. Gay transmen, Bi transpeople, Lesbian transwomen and every other sexual attraction paired with the queer spectrum.
What is ‘IIUC’?
“If I Understand Correctly”, most likely. Same pattern as “If I Recall Correctly” (IIRC).
As in feeling like a man and born male, and also attracted to men?
Yes. Those are the manliest of men.
And they’ve got the theme song for Two and a Half Men playing in their heads at all times
Wasn’t cis and trans isomerism a part of Chemistry from classes 9-12, or maybe it’s just stuff education system in some countries don’t teach? I’m genuinely curious if you were/were not taught this in your school days?
Cis and trans are indeed chemistry terms to denote isomerism, but that doesn’t typically occur until college (specifically organic chemistry) in the States.
Most people probably aren’t aware of that meaning in the US.
Can confirm. Well-educated American. Never heard of it (didn’t study chem in college).
The use of the word cis has its roots in an obscure Usenet group; it’s genesis (apparently) rooted in a desire for more inclusive language for trans folks (the notion that “gender” Vs “transgender” was too othering).
It hit Tumblr like a train in the 2010s, and became a symbolic phrase in trans counterculture. “Cisgender” was less than popular with non-trans people, as it robbed them of the illusion of normality and turned the word “gender” into a social trap.
It later found derogatory use in the phrase “cissy” (a counter for the popular derogatory term “tranny”).
It’s a fun word with an interesting history, and it has helped contribute to the wider acceptance of trans folks.
Cissy boy
I am cisgender
I don’t understand why that’s a bad thing?
I don’t understand a lot of this political gender shit tbh. I’m just chillin
Samesies. Here for the support and the dank memes. Not offended to get labeled. I’m also questioning if most cisgender people take offense to the label. I feel like most wouldn’t. Maybe we’re talking about the minority that gets triggered by words that they don’t understand. I hope y’all don’t rope the whole cis culture in with the haters, because you don’t have to be queer to understand the plight of non-binary peoples. Just sayin’.
Yeah I mean I definitely don’t understand the whole non-binary thing, to me it seems silly. But they aren’t hurting anyone, or affecting my life in any way, so why care?
What?
This thread is such a microcosm of today’s discourse.
Everyone attributing malice to anyone they don’t agree with, everyone looking to dunk on people and up votes / down votes piling on in batches based on trends.
It is possible to not immediately be on board with new terms without being a bigot. Sometimes it’s just a misunderstanding or lack of knowledge or sometimes just preference.
I’ve said it before I will address people as they wish to be addressed. If somone has been called a straight male for all their life and they want to be called that it changes nothing for me. Calling them a bigot is counterproductive and just causes divides for no reason.
Straight people are the worst of all options.
Removed by mod
Nobody renamed anything, we just called it what it was more concisely than just saying “normal” lol
Removed by mod
in the jargon of psychological journals from 1990s
Wrong on the when and wrong on the why. https://www.etymonline.com/word/cisgender#etymonline_v_53367
Equality feels like oppression, to the privileged.
Removed by mod
If only sex was as simple as a selection of gametes. There is a wide range of chromosomal, hormonal, genitalia, and physiological variation in human sex characteristics, and it is much more common than you think. And that is ignoring much more subtle variation and overlap between the sexes - cognitive, emotional, psychological - that are just as much a part of the natural variation of human sex as any other.
And before you come back with an argument about some rhetoric about “conditions” or what ever - all of evolution starts as a rare variation that becomes common in a certain population. Certain eye colors are nearly the same rarity.
Finally, there are plenty of animals that have individuals that do not reproduce. Examples are naked mole rats. We aren’t a eusocial species, but it isn’t to say we don’t have some very early characteristics of it.
Removed by mod
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
deleted by creator
Removed by mod
And I am not talking about hate from transphobes, fuck those guys
A little self-hate is always nice
Removed by mod
