Duh. They use phones mostly. A lot of the gen z people I know are just as bad as boomers with tech. Millennials and gen x had that sweet spot of “actually having to learn how shit works not just iphone go brrr.”
Yeah I don’t know why the article mentions Gen Z’s “tech-savvy reputation”. Being able to operate a cell phone doesn’t make you tech savvy.
Gen X and Millennials grew up using command line and troubleshooting computer problems before the Internet. Their tech skills are way higher than Gen Z.
I never needed to use command line, but I did hone my typing skills on MIRC and ICQ.
*Mavis Beacon.
Anyone responsible for the family IT services had to learn cmd.
I’m thankful my father was so insistent on teaching me to type properly. At the time I was super annoyed at him putting a cardboard cutout over the keyboard so I couldn’t see keys. But touch typing has been a boon ever since, I doubt dad was prepping me for typing quickly mid-game but it sure is nice!
My dad was similar. Guess thats a good thing looking back. I’m going to teach my kid pivot tables so they can rule the world.
Pretty sure booting into DOS before loading Windows and playing the Oregon Trail on the Apple IIe both count as command line experience.
I also think that as smug as a lot people feel about this, it doesn’t seem far off to think that physical keyboard typing skills could be substituted with newer technologies, or refined versions of existing tech. At least in terms of performing most office job functions.
I’m not saying it’ll be more efficient, or better, just that it wouldn’t be a surprising next step given the trends being discussed here.
If that happens, I have no doubt that smugness will turn into self-righteous indignation and a stubborn refusal to abandon the tactile keyboard for older generations, myself included.
I just hope that if that transition occurs during my lifetime, it’s an either-or situation, and not a replacement of the keyboard.
Key chording has always been faster than conventional single letter typing, and that tech has been around for a long time now in the form of stenography machines. Yet most people learn on a conventional keyboard because it’s simpler and more ubiquitous. This is true even now that chording has been adapted to programming and similar tasks.
You have to remember we live in a world where most people don’t even know how to write properly, even those who do it as part of their job like doctors. If you draw letters by moving your fingers, you’re doing it wrong by the way. The actual proper technique involves using your shoulder, elbow, and wrist to do most of the work. We’ve known about this for centuries, and these techniques were designed with dip pens, quils, brush, and fountain pens in mind. The cheap ballpoint pen along with rather bad instructions from teachers has led to proper handwriting technique being forgotten, and causes problems like RSI in people who handwrite regularly.
Oh ball point pens. Last I heard one of the thing they do preserve in primary school over here is the good ole progression from pencil to fountain pen and sticking for that for the whole four years. Pencil because if you use too much force you break the thing without breaking it, it’s just annoying, and that’s the point, once they switch to fountain pens they’re not going to bend them. Also, cursive from the start. There’s important lessons about connecting up letters in there: Writing single letters properly is harder than cursive because on top of moving your pen over the paper, you have to lift it. Much easier if you already have proper on-paper movement down.
I am quite partial to ink rollers nowadays but still can’t stand ordinary ball points. They feel wrong.
I too think ball point pens are horrible. Fountain pens are not that expensive, last a lot longer as they are refillable, and just write better. There are some rather bad fountain pens out there though lol. Platinum Preppy is pretty much the gold standard for cheap pens under £10 or $10. Platinum plasir is a little more expensive but has a more durable body and cap made of metal using the same nib and feed as the preppy. You can also get disposable fountain pens now that aren’t half bad.
Liquid ink roller balls are a good product too and are a nice middle ground between ball point and fountain pen. Although to be fair I wouldn’t be against a return to good old fashioned dip pens as these are the best for calligraphy and honestly look cool as heck in my opinion.
The trouble with fountain pens is that they don’t really expect you to not write for a month or two. The ones with built-in tank would be less annoying there as you can easily uncrust everything by pulling in some ink through the feather (is that what the tip is called in English? I have no idea), but their great downside is that when they make a mess, they make a real mess. Ink rollers you can put in a pocket without worrying and they don’t really dry out. Mostly though you don’t have to ram them into the paper to write.
Also, clutch pencils. Those mechanical ones that take leads that are as thick as usual wood-encased ones, and that you sharpen. If you ever have like 10 bucks burning a hole in your pocket get yourself some koh-i-noor clutch pencils and collection of leads (usual is HB but I’d suggest trying out 2B for writing), suitable sharpener (pencils come with an emergency one but it’s not too nice), as well as two tombow erasers: The ordinary one, and the dust catch one. Life’s too precious to waste nerves on shoddy leads and erasers. Also a Faber-Castel kneadable eraser: Even if you don’t draw it’s occasionally useful to be able to have a fine eraser tip. koh-i-noor leads are reportedly good enough for both artists and engineers and, truth be told, what could be a more perfect combination of endorsements. And, as said, like 10 bucks total.
Forcing children to do cursive was not really the point I am trying to make. Yes it’s technically more efficient to write that way, but it’s also considerably more complicated. Forcing children with disabilities to do it leads to all kinds of problems, and makes their writing less legible. I am more talking about techniques that avoid issues like RSI. If we are making children do things we should be teaching them the correct way to do it, not half assing it. While I think we should still teach cursive, I don’t think it should be mandatory. In fact I actually want to see more keyboard use with proper ten finger technique, as that is useful for the real world. Typing technique is also something schools love to neglect. It’s also better to give kids that option as even with better handwriting instruction some just do not have the required motor skills through no fault of their own. People like me were forced to do handwriting practice despite having significant coordination issues, and never being taught the right technique. Eventually I had to dig through obscure corners of the Internet to find out the right way. Situations like that should never be allowed to continue for as long as it did in my case. Either by actually teaching the right technique in the first place, or in cases where that doesn’t work by switching to typing instead.
Forcing children with disabilities to do it
If we are making children do things we should be teaching them the correct way to do it, not half assing it.
…which includes cursive. Also for disabled folks, as far as possible: At that point you’re teaching fine motor mechanics first and foremost, secondly writing. How quickly they write is of no great consequence (or we’d be teaching shorthand), how well their motor skills develop is. The usual approach here is that you get a set cursive with a couple of options and alternative glyph shapes for the first four years, then you can develop from there as you wish. Some kids arguably should get more hand-holding in the “develop for yourself” part.
That you didn’t learn it the right way is a thing you can blame on your teachers, but not cursive. Like, I mentioned pencils and fountain pens, ball-point pens are outlawed in schools here: It’s so that kids don’t use pressure, which makes them not tense up and cramp, which makes developing proper technique way easier. Though if the coordination issues are sub-clinical they generally should be sorted out before primary school starts, that’s a job for the kindergarten, making sure that everyone has a proper baseline in physical, social, and language skills.
Anyone else play Montezuma’s Revenge or that DOS King Kong game throwing explosive bananas after inputting stuff for height, angle, force?
You mean that inferior version of Scorched Earth?
Lol. I just went googling and it was Qbasic Gorrilas! Now that takes me back.
AI powered keyboard let’s go. Honestly the amount of typing I’ve been able to cut out by just clicking the ai suggested replies in Teams instead of actually typing something out to respond to my coworkers is pretty high.
I learned mine playing a MUD
You typed fast or you died.
For me it was WoW back when it was more social and you had to communicate via text mid fights and whatnot
Definitely RuneScape that did it for me
This is why I feel disconnected from most of my gen z people
Being able to operate a cell phone doesn’t make you tech savvy
it does, to a boomer
Yep. And phone typing is the ‘hunt and peck’ method of keyboard typing. Which is unfortunate because it’s ingraining the slowest way to type onto a whole generation.
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Autocorrect begs to differ, usually only when the word is out of my field of vision.
I took typing, on typewriters, but got efficient years later on IRC and ICQ. 60+more wpm. I’m still fairly proficient on a familiar KB too.
any good IRC servers left or did it all move to discord? Ive been meaning to get on an IRC server thats not just a mirror of the in-game chat of the game I play.
I don’t know, it was a very long time ago. Maybe do a search, based on your interests?
Gen Z here, most of my online life is on IRC. Learned about its existence a couple years ago. It is very much alive, although most people left there are at least semi-technical, and I miss the non-technical crowd.
Slashnet still exists and it’s fairly active depending on the channel. #xkcd was bumping last time I checked my client.
Libera is quite active
Tried using swipe typing before and honestly I’m just faster typing normally.
Yeah, autocorrect is bad enough without the extra emphasis on it with swipe.
It’s vastly better when you need to type with one hand
True, but otherwise I just type faster normally.
It works well for casual conversation. But if you’re trying to have a technical conversation it will fail on uncommon or custom words or phrases.
Can confirm, it’s worth the effort.
Yeah, I’m a swiper myself and I can’t imagine anyone being able to swipe without knowing the keyboard layout like one would for typing.
There’s a mode where you swipe your finger over each letter in order and it auto completes the word. Not sure how often younger people use it (though I wasn’t aware you could do that until I saw someone younger doing it).
Sounds like predictive T9 but slower
No it’s actually way faster. You can swipe whole words in less than a second. It’s like writing with pen and paper but each letter is actually a whole word.
Agreed, it’s pretty great. And while the computer sometimes misunderstands what you swipe, it will show you potential alternatives you can tap on. Like in this screenshot:
T9 was supreme.
They also stopped teaching typing in schools. My younger family members never had an computer class or a typing class.
Anything beyond ~2002 became worse than the predecessor in IT related tasks.
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I’m part of Gen Z, and no, we as a generation AREN’T tech savvy. just because we grew up with smart phones does not make us tech savvy. in fact, i actually think it made us dumber with tech. i’m the only one in my school who knows how to use a command line and code (i also use linux as my daily driver). meanwhile everyone else doesn’t even know what a freaking file manager is
Millennial here: I think what Gen X and Boomer authors mean when they say ‘GenZ is more tech savvy’ is basically just that they use social media apps on phones and play video games, and that more of their culture derives from such things.
Maybe tech-immersed would be a better term.
As far as actual tech competency goes?
Yeah I agree with you. Phones and apps are generally reliable enough now that there’s far less need to figure out anything under the hood, unlike in my day where you kind of had to learn more about a system to do what is now common, and you had to type on a keyboard.
Hi, I’m a programmer. Most of my classmates didn’t know how to use Linux.
Now, I’ve realized that newer products are being developed via Visual Studio so……
Linux and command line knowledge aren’t the same as being tech savvy
linux can be used through mostly GUI now so i partly agree with you, but installing linux can be quite a hard task for those who aren’t tech savvy. i’m pretty sure being able to do the following can be considered tech savvy:
- change boot settings
- flash an ISO to a USB drive
- shrink windows partition into a new one for linux
- boot from USB
- actually install linux
- get used to linux
Edit: the thing is… everyone is so used to things being pre-installed (ie windows/macOS/iOS), being able to download apps easily from the apple App Store. anything even slightly more complicated than that is too hard for them. i’ve had a graphic design class with some people a few years ago and some of them had to ask me for help for how to open a file, save, and export. if something isn’t completely, 100% automated for them, they can’t do it.
Can you not order Ubuntu on a DVD anymore? Also you’re explaining dual boot. You can just single boot linux
i’m not sure. most people at my school use a laptop at their main computer, so they couldn’t use an ubuntu DVD anyways. i personally prefer dual boot over single boot
… did everyone remove the media drive off laptops? There are also external media drives.
I think it has been probably more than 5 years since I have seen an optical drive on a new laptop.
ultrahellabased.tar.gz
Um is there anything special to use Linux? Click the GUI.
Well installing it. That alone requires a challenge most folks probably couldn’t overcome easily. People are accustomed to just getting a computer with a working os on it. Changing that os would be pretty hard for them.
And let’s be real, you at least need a degree of tech savvy to deal with the inevitable issues that will come up. Even on the simplest distro.
IDK, only times when I broke things on Debian were when I made the unwise decisions to do things I don’t fully understand (that doesn’t really happen now). And my elderly mom uses Mint with less problems than she did Windows.
It’s a different paradigm for windows users. “Why won’t this exe/msi install on my computer?”
But also, once you realize the unlimited potential to customize it’s pretty special. I, for one, hate using anything without a tiling windows manager.
So how do you install things?
Red hat based? Install the RPM. Debian based? Install the deb, generally? Install from the repository. You can also install from source if you’d like
I don’t know what any of that means.
You don’t generally download the file like you would an exe or MSI on windows. Rather you enter a command line that tells Linux to connect to the repository (like an app store) of that particular type of Linux, pull the latest installation file and install it.
You can still download the file and install it directly, but it’s not a straightforward double click like on windows.
Look in the OS provided “App Store” first - GUI or not, your choice.
Can’t find what you’re looking for? Look for a TRUSTED alternative App Store source. Then check the App Store again.
Still can’t find it? Look to see if there is a package available that your OS can recognize (different based on what flavor of Linux you’re running)
Still can’t find it? See if you can find the code to build the dang thing yourself.
Installing things on linux is generally the same as phones. There’s a shop-like GUI where you can look up your applications and get them, they’ll also update automatically.
If the software isn’t in your distribution repository, that’s when it starts to be like windows, you need to hunt it down and either get an appimage or something like that, or build and compile it yourself.
The most common explanation I’ve seen, and imo it makes sense, is that things mostly just work now. Even XP required a helluva lot more troubleshooting and messing with stuff to make it work than today. So you not only have a bunch of people that have no troubleshooting experience, a large portion don’t even know how to properly search for things.
On the flip side, you have a lot more people doing insanely impressive stuff at a lot younger ages because if you have the drive to do it, there’s more material to learn than ever out there.
I’m a millennial but I grew up with Macs which mostly just worked, I don’t remember having to do much troubleshooting as a kid.
But for me it was more that there was nothing else to do. You got bored, and messed around with and explored the computer, figuring out what you could make it do. Even once we got internet, it was dialup, so you got online for a bit, checked some things, downloaded some shareware, then disconnected and were stuck with whatever was on the computer again to mess with.
These days the kids have a never-ending social media feed, they have no reason to ever be bored again.
The boomers had cars and flexed being able to drive stick or know what a carburetor is, unlike those feeble Millennials. They had that greaser subculture. Hmm. I guess that makes the movie Grease the equivalent of War Games or Hackers.
So what is the zoomer thing? What eye-rolling help do they give to doddering old gen-Xers? What will they flex in their old age?
The darned neural implant generation doesn’t even know how to doomscroll with their fingers. Kids these days smh no cap.
The tech-savvy reputation comes from the “digital native” narrative i.e. because they grew up with computers they must know computers, which is a silly fallacy because how one interacts with technology makes all the difference. It’s the same reason why everyone who grew up with electricity isn’t necessarily an electrician.
The tech savvy reputation comes from millenials. We ARE tech savvy.
Only the early ones. By definition millenials are birth years 1981 to 1996, so the last ones were 11 when the first iPhone released.
I think every generation has their percentage of nerds and that just was a little higher in late Gen X and early millenials because computers were so new and you had to tinker to get anything working.
As an older Gen Z, yeah you guys probably have a better grasp on modern tech. Weirdly enough I actually have found that a weirdly high amount of folks my age know old analogue tech better, like vacuum tubes and old cars.
Older gen z here too, born in ‘99, and while I haven’t noticed the analogue thing, I’ve 100% noticed tech illiteracy in general.
Like, I’m talking about having a downloads folder full of junk because they don’t know that that’s where downloads end up. Installers left untouched after programs are installed because they’re worried that deleting the installer will delete the installed program.
Imo being raised with closed ecosystems like iPhones really stunted tech literacy for a lot of people. I grew up jailbreaking my phones and used my parent’s windows pc, so I kind of escaped it.
Yeah im also '99, and the weird analogue thing is probably regional. Yeah I agree that the tech illiteracy comes down largely to closed systems like Iphone, the most tech literate folks I know that are our age were largely on the poorer side of working class. Which makes sense if you are using hand me down tech ya probably will be doing a bit of debugging.
Like, I’m talking about having a downloads folder full of junk because they don’t know that that’s where downloads end up.
Funny enough, at work I’ll often re-download a file if I need it because it’s faster to go to my bookmark, load the page, download the file, and then click on it in my browser’s recent downloads. Windows search is sooooooo absurdly slow.
But then came smartphones, and instead they grew up with that…
In the days of Apple II and similar machines a person who operated a computer knew it, because computers were simpler and because there was no other way and because you’d generally buy a cheaper toy if you didn’t want to learn it.
Also techno-optimism of the 70s viewed the future as something where computers make the average person more powerful in general - through knowing how to use a computer in general, that is, knowing how to write programs (or at least “create” something, like in HyperCard).
That was the narrative consistent with the rest of technology and society of that time, where any complex device would come with schematics and maintenance instructions.
Then something happened - most humans couldn’t keep up with the growing complexity. Something like that happened with me when I went to uni with undiagnosed AuDHD. There was a general path in the future before me - going there and learning there - but I didn’t know how I’m going to do that, and I just tried to persuade myself that I must, it should happen somehow if I do same things others do with more effort. Despite pretense and self-persuasion, I failed then.
It’s similar to our reality. The majority stopped understanding what happens around them, but kept pretending and persuading itself that it’s just them, that the new generation is fine with it all, that they don’t need those things they fail to understand, etc. Like when in class you don’t understand something, but pretend to. All the older generation does that. The younger generation does another thing - they try to ignore parts of the world they don’t understand, like hiding their heads in the sand. Or like a bullied kid just tries not to think about bullies. Or like a person living in a traditionally oppressive state just avoids talking about politics and society.
That narrative has outlived its reality not only with computers.
People are eager to believe in magic. Do you need to know how to cook if you have dinner and breakfast trees (thank you, LF Baum)? So they think we have such trees. It’s an illusion, of course. Very convenient, isn’t it, to make so many industries inaccessible to amateurs.
It’s very simple. There’s such a thing as “too complex”. The tower of Babel is one fitting metaphor.
You don’t need this complexity in an AK rifle. Just like that, you don’t need it in an analog TV. And in a digital TV you need much less complexity too. We don’t have it in our boots - generally. We don’t have it in our shirts. Why would we have it in things with main functionality closer to them in complexity than to SW combat droids?
I think Stanislaw Lem called this a “combinatoric explosion” when predicting it in one of his essays.
Being a tool user doesn’t make one a tool maker, though having grown up in the days you had to assemble and maintain your own tools does naturally facilitate growing into the latter from the former.
Right? I grew up with pen and paper, but I’m better with keyboards.
They use apps.
On phones.
They aren’t tech savvy.
Gen Z is app savvy, not tech savvy. Very very different.
I taught a bunch of Gen Zers back when they were in high school. None of them knew how to type well, and it was a rarity that any of them knew how to type at all. I was supposed to teach them things like Microsoft Office, but we had to start with typing and basic PC usage before we could move on to something as complicated as MS Word.
This is what happens when people don’t use computers and instead just use cell phones.
And Chromebooks. All the schools pretty much use Chromebooks, at least in my region
It’s pretty messed up that schools enforce those things onto kids. Chromebooks, while cheap, invade the hell out of your privacy and are extremely restrictive. We should be teaching kids GNU/Linux, not ChromeOS… I honestly feel sorry for the future of free software. Students aren’t taught ethics, freedom, or privacy at ALL. I was in school, (graduated two years ago), and it seemed that every teacher adapted the “you don’t have privacy” motto. Absolutely terrible. Buy the kids a Dell Latitude E6400 and put Libreboot/Trisquel with KDE on it. Let them live and help each other out with issues. It would be super heart warming to see schools adapt something like this instead.
(I understand the convenience issues, but we should start adapting, its crazy that Gen Z barely know anything about computers)
You sound exactly like my friend. But he would probably say stick to thinkpads
What tech savvy reputation? They doesn’t even know what a system file structure is. Neither the article writer, social media =/= tech-savvy.
I was the electronics guy at walmart and just…holy shit the kids buying laptops. A lot didn’t even know how to work the keyboard. They would touch a non touchscreen laptop then ask me ‘if it isn’t touch screen then how do you work it’. Thats just one of a million amazing questions I got.
I know a bit of it is…iono…location bias? Most kids who know computers are probably shopping online or microcenter or something but still.
They doesn’t even know what a system file structure is.
I had to talk to somebody about a file that they needed me to look at and they kept saying It’s the one in the P drive, and they just could not understand that they needed to give me the absolute file path. This was someone who’s an engineer working in a power station, yet they don’t understand about drive mappings
P for power?
I can’t remember that justification for all the drive letters. They had Q for quick at one point, because that drive was an SSD and not an HDD so I guess it was quick.
I think P was the public, as in not an internal drive, and something external contractors could see. But still I needed the actual file path.
I had a girl drop out of my University class because she couldn’t figure out what a “file” was or how to “email” it to me. She just kept trying to share her Apple storage with me. Really sad. It’s hard to help someone who gets to university without even grasping the basic nature of a file system.
Their parents don’t even give them PCs, only phones, how would they even learn?
I’ve literally never heard Gen Z described as tech savvy.
The boomers says that to them but that’s really not true, this day this generation is less and less “tech savvy”, they’re just good at using the basic way social media
but gen z is not tech savvy. They can use a browser. and watch youtube. They never advance past that stage
I think for the most part they are just “good” at using mainstream social medias nothing really more
You would think they know how to use a browser but in reality they only use apps. TikTok being their preferred search engine speaks volumes.
😔
Man look at millennials turning into boomers at record pace
“back in my day we did things properly, now all these damn kids… etc etc”
it’s not becoming boomers. It’s about rarely meeting one who knows that, for example, wifi is not the internet. I’m not asking for detailed tech knowledge. But getting a blank face if asked something as simple as “where did you save the file?” or replying with “in the gallery/google photos” means you are not tech savvy. these are the absolute basics.
What’s your sample size, do you actually talk to many gen z
If you asked them where they saved a photo on a smartphone they’re not going to tell you a filepath because that’s not how people use smartphones. I probably couldn’t tell you where photos are stored physically on my phone without going out of my way to find that info
Also Google photos is a valid answer to that question because the file is saved in Google photos, just because it’s cloud storage doesn’t make it not storage. In that case local storage is basically just a cache anyway
So not tech savvy?
because that’s not how a phone is used.
But it is how any phone/desktop/laptop pollworks. So you’re proving my point. Most can’t even tell if the file they want is on the device in the first place, if they use stuff like cloud backups. To those people, the file is “in google”. Not tech savvy
What’s your sample size, do you actually talk to many gen z
They aren’t the only ones to have noticed this issue.
If you asked them where they saved a photo on a smartphone…
“Where did you save the file” isn’t typically asked in the context of a smart phone. Maybe on Android more so than iOS.
Being able to use TikTok on your phone doesn’t make you tach savvy. They don’t know anything about how it all works. It’s a false dichotomy.
Yeah. I’ve noticed the new generation coming into the workplace can’t do shit on a computer.
They’ve grown up on apps that have simple interfaces and limited options. Give them the freedom and power of a workstation and you’ll find they never learned to learn real software.
People who know nothing more than how to operate a smartphone are not tech savvy. They can’t even do that properly. Never seen anyone from that generation use an ad blocker or revanced or anything else that combats enshittification.
The highest usage of ad blockers happens within the age range of 18-24, which categorically includes Gen Z.
The second highest age range is 25-34, and the third highest is 12-17, which is also included in Gen Z.
That said, I would argue that, while knowing how to use a smartphone doesn’t make you tech savvy, knowing how to use an ad blocker doesn’t either. It’s as easy as installing an extension.
If I had to guess, it’s because they don’t know what it was like before the ads and enshittification.
Can’t long to return to something you never had.
Wikipedia says Gen Z is born from mid to late 90s, which makes me a Gen Z’er. I use adblocker and try combat enshittification a few ways, including contributing to the commons. My day job is being a firmware developer for an opensource company. I’d say I’m tech savvy.
I think there are quite a lot of people like me, it is just that there are more people using technology at younger ages, effectively diluting the pool of Gen Z’ers you are encountering both online and in person.
I suppose its easy to find tech savvy gen-z people on Lemmy ;)
Obviously what I was referring to is anecdotal and stems from my social bubble. But there is something to it, that growing up with dumbed down devices makes you less prone to dive deep into the details of tech. If I were born 2 decades later, I don’t think I would have gathered as much tech know-how as I did. I essentially had to go through all of it (started in the 286 era with PC-DOS, broke my dad’s PC countless times trying to make shareware games work, dabbled around on bulletin boards, grew up with the early stages of internet and saw how it turned to shit, etc.). If I didn’t have that, I might just have ended up knowing nothing more than smartphones.
Gen X that think Gen Zs are tech savvy are probably the people that the actual Gen X nerds shake their head at when we have to teach them how to put an URL in the address bar instead of searching for Gmail and clicking on the link every. goddamn. time.
Yes, as a Gen X I’m sometimes surprised how tech illiterate some of my generation are…
Then I remember when we were kids and people like me using computers were seen as weird geeks and “normal people” wouldn’t get close to a computer.
Ngl I hate most of the new domain options. Was that site a .com or .net was fine. Now you have a dozen common options and many sites have a silly name. Look at lemmy itself for great examples of it.
People believe just because someone interacts with some sort of digital device, it makes you an expert on computers. The thing is, it depends on the type of operating system you are interacting with.
For example when I was young, my father would buy those big old gray computers from yard sales. I would mix and match the pieces inside to build my own PC. I broke a lot of shit but learned a lot.
The operating system was one where you more or less had total control over the computer. By 12~13 I was using CD-Roms to load different Linux distros and play around with all sorts of different things.
This experience basically taught me how operating systems work at a fundamental level. How it needs a kernel, how it loads and maintains services, packages, etc. How file systems work and learning how terminals are useful. Scripting languages, and eventually coding applications.
Compare and contrast that to the young kids of today. What do they get? A phone and a tablet. You can’t open it up. You can’t tinker with it. The OS is closed off and is deliberately made as difficult as possible to modify. No mouse, no keyboard. Streamlined UIs with guard rails.
You get what you get and you don’t get upset. That doesn’t leave nearly as much room for exploration and curiosity. It’s a symptom of our computers becoming more and more railroaded. More and more control by large companies.
It’s really sad, I think. Fairly soon I believe every device will be a “thin device” or essentially a chrome book. Very little local processing power and instead it’ll essentially stream from a server.
I just want to echo your sentiment with something I’ve been saying here for a while now:
Do not confuse information technology use for computer literacy.
I will continue to argue that GenX is the only true technology literate generation because we grew up with the technology as it evolved. Future generations are more consumers not partners in the technology they own.
Yea it’s a vast generalization but Apple is a good analogy of this. Most people now just want “a technology that works” without any understanding or control over how it works. That’s a recipe for technological serfdom under the new generation of technocratic companies designed to own us.
Am I ever going to own a free phone? Probably not, but that doesn’t excuse me from at least understanding from a high level all the players involved in my phone and where they’re generating value from me.
I will continue to argue that GenX is the only true technology literate generation because we grew up with the technology as it evolved.
This is a terrible argument. Technology is always evolving. There have been like 10 different versions of Windows that I’ve used growing up as a millennial, across 3 different architectures, with huge advances in storage, memory, CPU speeds, and graphics processing - it’s pretty ignorant to dismiss all that and claim Gen X “grew up with the technology”. Like duh, every generation “grows up with the technology” of their generation.
I think the point I’ve seen elsewhere on this post is more accurate - every generation has some technologically literate people and some technologically illiterate people. Congrats, you happen to be literate, but I guarantee for every one of you, there’s also a Gen X’er that can barely function a computer enough to check their email. Just like the boomer generation, and the millennials, and even Gen Z and Alpha. This whole “XYZ generation is the most ABC” bullshit is just another way to create divides, and make people forget we’re all way more alike than we are different.
How did any generation not grow up with the technology as it evolved? Gen X did not invent computers, nor did the Boomers, but every generation made valuable contributions, just as Gen Z will. Again, it is the actions and ideas of gifted individuals that count.
I’m a programmer. I write hundreds of lines of code a day (of varying levels of quality ofc). I also fix technology (phones, laptops, desktops. tablets, etc). I’m probably one of the most “tech-savvy” people I know. I very rarely type faster than 70 wpm. it’s just not necessary for what most of us are doing.
But think about arguing online! It’s apparently a hobby and to be competitive, you need to be able to spew bullshit at amazing rates. Personally I’ve maxed out at 140 wpm, but usually stay in the 100 wpm range.
Programming? Idk, I spend more time thinking than typing personally. Good code requires you to consider all the corner cases and such.
It’s apparently a hobby and to be competitive, you need to be able to spew bullshit at amazing rates. Personally I’ve maxed out at 140 wpm
I’m limited by the rate at which I can think of bullshit.
Well there’s your problem. Don’t think. Just bullshit.
I prefer to argue on the internet via my phone, which I can type pretty fast on thanks to the swipe to type.
and yeah programming simply doesn’t require fast typing, I tend to diagram everything out on my whiteboard before even opening my ide. I just have to write tons and tons of code since I’m in a few low level programming classes
I diagram everything out in my brain and it evolves continuously while I’m writing code
Sometimes I feel it’s a miracle I get anything done at all but then usually the end result is better than what I’d originally envisioned so it kinda balances out.
I used to do that but the more I get into os programming the more I’ve found myself scrapping entire 1000+ line files and rewriting the entire thing 🙃
and I think “it’s a miracle I get anything done” is a very common thought in most programmers heads lol
and yeah programming simply doesn’t require fast typing
Funny enough making MC plugins and mods while moderating my own server was what got me to over 100 WPM
Because without meds my brain fires so fast that if I DIDNT type at 115 I’d have forgotten where my for loop was going before ive even finished the conditions it triggers under
My code is slooooooopppyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy thanks to that, but it’s also not for anyone else’s eyes ever so im good
The someone else’s eyes are your eyes a few months down the line when you have to fix something
Bold of you to assume I don’t just let those errors in the log pile up
If I don’t look at the log then they don’t exist!
Agreed. I write slow and incomprehensible. I read slow with shit comprehension. Passed engineering school with very high GPA and am successful in my engineering career. These metrics are bullshit boomer click bait.
Almost as bad as “Gen z/a can’t read analog clocks!”
I think the panic around analog clocks comes from the scenario where you have to explain what clockwise and counterclockwise is. I have personally seen someone eventually removed from a workgroup because they couldn’t understand it.
Not that analog clocks matter, but that was an easy way to teach direction in cylindrical coordinates. What can we use now for that?
I hope someone said “watch your 6” and they slammed the door on their ass.
80wpm is pretty common for a typical average typing speed for anybody who can touch type, 100wpm is more common among programmers, and people who do a lot of typing. Anything faster than that and you have had hand injuries and use a fancy keyboard now, or you will soon have hand injuries.
typing speed is rather funny.
I type 120. How fucked am I, doctor?
if you do it for sustained periods for long periods of time, you should probably think about investing in one of those fancy ortholinear keyboards, or whatever works best for you. Maybe switch to dvorak or azerty for funsies or something.
if you don’t type very regularly, it’s probably not as big of a deal.
It is so much better I switched to a 36 key split ortho keyboard(draculad) with colemak and layers to reach keys farther then 1 key away normally it feels amazing
yeah, once you’re using a keyboard designed for actual hand positioning, it’s much more manageable and generally, a lot less taxing on the individual.
i could type insanely fast when i was younger
developed RSI at work
not worth it
Copy and paste is the fastest type
