Please go into lots of detail - some of us are taking notes!
Ireland. I’m a firm believer that if you move to a region that speaks a different language, you need to make a genuine effort to learn that language. After having 3 years of foreign language (including a year of Gaelic when I lived in Ireland as a child for a year), I know it’s not my thing, so an English speaking country is a requirement for me. Ireland is gorgeous, and still in the EU. Scotland would also be top of the list if they split from the UK and joined the EU.
We’re thinking Scotland. There’s some real nice homes for reasonable prices. My wife’s already a UK citizen so that helps.
The kind of american that usually comes to Mexico is very nice, very welcome. Maybe the exceptions are the very loud and self absorbed ones that go to resort locations and act like they’re better than everyone there.
As long as people want to integrate and cooperate they are more than welcome.
Now, the sad part is the gentrification that comes with a lot of people moving and outpaying rent vs the locals. Now the average cost of living in Mexico city is about 50% higher than the average salary, and about 100% higher than the median salary. Another very negative thing is that now a lot of locals have to communicate in english because American people will come and not learn spanish over multiple years living here. There are zones where everything is in english now. It’s okay speaking english, it’s not okay expecting english from everyone.
So a few pointers:
- Integrate, pay taxes, consume locally
- Try and move into already gentrified places, avoid displacing more people
- Push for social policy, increased affordable living spaces, invest in the country where you move into to improve the locals’ life
Be friendly, but that’s always
La ciudad de México is what I’ve been thinking of. seems like a fabulous place. doubt I could take the heat and I’m more likely to end up in Asia, but Mexico City and Toronto are top contenders
Luckily mexico city is not actually that hot, quite humid though
yeah I’d prefer -30 over +30 and humid
Now the good thing with humidity is that refrigeration works wonders, and in Mexico Mini Splits are super cheap, as is electricity
Moving somewhere and not knowing the language is extremely common. My mother has been in the USA for 40 years and speaks very little English. She focuses on Spanish speaking neighborhoods and businesses.
Many of her friends have also been here decades and speak zero English too.
It’s inconsiderate at best to expect people to speak your foreign language and get angry that people don’t speak it. That’s more of my point.
And even that, after gentrifying an area no longer welcoming non-english speaking people or treating them as second class is worse
I absolutely agree. I didn’t make my point of learning the native language. I’m annoyed by native Spanish speaking immigrants purposefully not learning English while living in the USA for decades.
It seems it also happens with Americans that migrate to other countries.
I’m German and as far as I’m concerned the people who want to flee the current US administration are exactly the type of people you want to welcome with open arms.
As a trans woman I might need somewhere to go and I desperately hope that when that day comes someone like you is in charge if deciding if I get to stay.
the ones that cant stop sucking off trump, arent even leaving usa anyways(trump supporters/liberterians), they are too inside thier bubble. scientists and mds and engineers have much more options than people with non-graduate degrees unfortunately.
Are you specifically talking about north americans of european descent? As if Germany isn’t dipping right into their pre WW2 culture with Merz as chancellor and AfD getting more votes each year 🤡
Deutschland den Deutsche, Ausländer Raus
I’ve always thought there’s two kinds of Americans; the ones who have a passport and the ones who don’t.
If they’re willing to explore the world and recognise the US isn’t the whole universe I find them to be totally fine.
Whether or not someone has a passport is almost entirely based on the amount of wealth that person or their family has.
Where I grew up, almost nobody traveled abroad because nobody could afford it. Or at most, back in the day they would drive to Canada because you could cross without a passport.
For some reason getting a passport is like $200, plus whatever it takes to get the required supporting documents (eg: birth certificate, the photo). That’s not much by many metrics, but a lot of people in the US just don’t have $200 to spend.
In 2016 there were tens of million of Americans who couldn’t absorb a sudden $400 expense without going further into debt.
That number’s probably grown significantly since.
Drop in the bucket compared to the cost of travel. Your point still stands though.
It’s also convoluted process too. If you never had passport or haven’t renewed in like 15+years you have to reapply, and then set up a whole appointment, most are booked months it not longer in advanced and only specific location USPS in your area. The scientists currently emigrating to Europe are already well off individuals( that’s why MDS and scientists are considered well off peoples degrees), certainly not poor
Difficult to get a visa to other countries without a passport.
There are also Americans who had a passport of a different country before they naturalized
Californian - i want us, oregon, and washington to join canada.
It would be a dream if CANZUK happened, then it was joined by California and Cascadia. We could call it CACACANZUK.
That said, you would already be a powerful nation without joining anyone else. Don’t wait for us to get organised.
I went to Norway. Big recommend. That said, I refuse to call myself an expat or use the term expatriate. I am an immigrant. I think it is weird that white westerners get a special word and everybody else are filthy immigrants.
It’s semantics but the difference between expat and immigrants is an expat intends to return to their home country some day, where an immigrant does not.
it’s racism
if a westerner works with plans to return they are called expat, if it’s a non western, they are called migrants labour or foreign workers and are treated like shit.
they dont like to be called immigrants, because then they would have to be labeled like the “brown people” they say have hawking over.
Yes, but connotatively it is just a marker of privilege. Especially here, since what we’re talking about is immigration, not temporary work.
To me expat always referred to people that only stay temporarily, mostly sent abroad by the company they work at. As opposed to a migrant that is meaning to stay permanently (and eventually gains citizenship).
TIL the definition differs regionally (see wiki) and mostly not as I thought it was.
As a member of the CAF, if the US Armed Forces are getting rid of LGBTQ folks, I would be proud to welcome them as my comrades in arms.
Canadian Air Force?
Canada is certainly on my list of hopeful places.
Not quite. CAF is Canadian Armed Forces. The Air Force, specifically is the RCAF.
Thanks
Canadian here. I’ll welcome anyone who voted against Trump.
Those who voted for Trump or didn’t vote at all can die in a ditch.
Thank you for that. For me, if I make a big move, especially out of country, I gotta go somewhere warm. I live in the mountains of WV and last winter nearly ended my life, for real. I was just talking this through with a friend- is it better to flee or stand our ground against the fascists?
Removed by mod
Ok dude, I don’t have time to deal with your mental illness.
Here in Canada we’re trying to catch America’s brain drain. We especially need doctors quite desperately.
doctors
How’s the demand for nurses? I’ll be finishing up nursing school in less than a year! :D
Or support staff? I’m a surgical tech now, and some of my coworkers (other techs, schedulers - bottom of the medical food chain, but still with specialty experience) feel trapped here by their lack of higher education.
Nurses and caretaker staff “Pflege” are needed here in Germany too, but not sure how viable the pay is.
Depends. I know some nirses that work as “OP Schwestern” and they make good money.
But you can not compare a german Krankenpflegerin/Krankenpfleger with an US Nurse.
Afaik pay isn’t that bad, it’s working conditions that suck.
Check out bchealthcareers.ca for an example of what is being done to encourage medical professionals to make the move to Canada. This site is B.C. specific but it includes doctors, nurses, and allied health professions.
As a Canadian, it appears to me that most of the Americans who want to move here are doing so because they like and support the way that Canada is currently functioning, and that’s fine by me.
Immigrants who want the country to change for them are problematic. I almost think that first generation immigrants shouldn’t get to vote, it should be a gift to their children rather than themselves. That shouldn’t even need the child to be born in Canada, I’d actually be fine with anyone who goes through at least half their primary education (so let’s say grade 7 or younger) here being included if they moved here with their parents when they were younger.
Why would you assume that every single (non American) immigrant that comes here would want to change the way Canada is run? Considering the vast majority come here because they like the way it’s run. This is such a wild take.
Besides, the politics of this country were built on genocide and do not reflect the values of the land’s original caretakers that were here for tens of thousands of years. But I guess those first immigrants were correct in changing the way things are run here and so we should be upholding their values and their values only??
I hate the original people argument. There is no land on this earth that wasn’t conquered multiple times. Even the first nations in North America warred against each other and took land from each other many times before the Europeans showed up. It wasn’t a giant happy campfire singalong for 10,000 years.
Okay, but given your original comment that the people who “are already here” (eg. Canadian citizens) should be the only ones to vote, you do seem to be lending weight to the idea that people who were already here should be making the decisions.
Do you think that the first immigrants (settlers) to come here from England and France should also not have been allowed to decide on how the country was run? Or is it only new immigrants that shouldn’t be allowed a voice in government? What’s the cutoff?
I think they took the land, just like everyone else has been taking land for all of human history, and applying modern government concepts to something that happened a few hundred years ago is stupid.
We can try to prevent future injustices, we can fix wrongs that occurred in the lifetimes of people who are alive (like reparations for residential schools) but trying to go back and change things for anything done prior to anyone alive existing is stupid.
So the cutoff is “is anyone still alive that it directly happened to” and descendents do not count.
I wish I’d married a Canadian in 2004 when the getting was good, haha.
I even speak some French.
Americans would do anything to not call a general strike.
Get it organized. I’ll show up. Show us poor stupid lazy americans how easy it is to hold an extended general strike to effect a national change. I’m all in on it. Let’s fucking go everyone! This armchair analyst knows the way!
A birthstrike would be much easier to pull off than a general (labor) strike. Bills don’t stop just because you stopped working, and labor strikes require a high degree of coordination. It’s a significant risk for those going on strike.
In contrast, a birthstrike does not hurt your immediate situation, and actually likely helps it by preventing an increase in financial burden. Additionally, it requires no real degree of coordination. It can start small and pick up steam as more people jump onboard.
We’ve been in a pseudo-birth strike for decades, kids have been increasingly expensive as real wages dropped. The only thing it’s gotten us is regressive assaults on reproductive rights.
Surely it takes a long time and Trump will be dead our out of office before any difference can be seen?
Hypothetically, you could start seeing results in as little as 9 months if people coordinated and actually took it seriously. Even without any sort of concerted effort, I wouldn’t be surprised if the U.S. sees a drop in birth rates in 2026 as large numbers of people independently (i.e. without coordination) say “no thanks!”
Part of the point of birthstriking is that even if the effort ultimately doesn’t work, you’ve still succeeded in protecting your descendants from whatever thing you are striking against. For example, I don’t think we can stop climate change at this point. But even if it doesn’t save the environment, there is value choosing to not create new victims.
Are the results anything that would cause any pressure for change though?
Seems like you would want a lot of organisation too or its just a few people and maybe a 0.1% drop in the fertility rate.
Are the results anything that would cause any pressure for change though?
Won’t know until we try it 😃
Seems like you would want a lot of organisation too or its just a few people and maybe a 0.1% drop in the fertility rate.
Ideally yes, but even on a personal level the second paragraph (“Part of the point of birthstriking…”) still applies even if no one else joins in. This is in contrast to a labor strike that has no benefit to you (and is actively detrimental) if you try it without the backing of a large group of other people joining in.
It is easier to coordinate a birthstrike than a labor strike because it can be done incrementally. A labor strike absolutely depends on a significant % of the population engaging all at once. Otherwise it fails. A birthstrike can have participation build up over time since it doesn’t adversely affect your day-to-day life the way that a labor strike does, thus it can be held indefinitely. In contrast to working, reproduction is completely optional on an individual level.
But yes, it absolutely stretches out the time frame. Labor strikes produce results in days or weeks. Now we are looking at months and years.
Probably Finland, or another Nordic country. Idk, I just like the cold and the woods and figure those oughtta fit the bill
Why is the difference between immigrant and ex patriot?
Ex patriot is a whitewashing term for immigrant. Because immigrants has a negative connotation so whites had to make up another term so they could differentiate themselves.
That is what I figured.
“Expatriate”
Buddy I already have. ✌️
If you migrate from a rich country to a poor country you’re an expat.
If you migrate from a poor country to a rich country you’re an immigrant and you’re both lazy and taking all the jobs and welfare and healthcare.
It’s relative to the country - you expatriate from your country of origin, and become an immigrant to a new host country.
Expatriate and emigrate are more or less synonyms.
ex patriot
That’s what I became when the Nazis took over as a result of being overwhelming popular to US voters. Turns out it’s not just a handful of powerful fuckers taking advantage of the rest of us: ‘we the people’ are, for the most part, just evil.
No, the difference is whether you are just residing outside your home country or actually immigrating to the new country. It is the difference between a vacation and moving somewhere. It is more along the lines of external patriot than former patriot.
Someone who still sees themselves as a citizen of their home country and just happens to live elsewhere is an expat. So an American living in Mexico is an expat, no matter what their length of stay is. If they immigrate, they are moving permanently and they see themselves as a part of the new country, either by seeking citizenship or claiming that as their ‘home’ as part of their identity.
silly responses here… the actual difference is permanence. immigration is relocating your life. expatriating is an extended vacation. it has the white guy connotation because white people usually stay temporarily, they dont immigrate for life.
My post was a bit tongue in cheek. I was pretty sure it was just peops not wanting to say immigrant even if they are staying forever.
maybe! there is probably also some joy in saying that you’re leaving the old world behind
Ex patriots move to work in a foreign country for a limited period, with the intention of returning to their home country. Typically these are white collar workers who move between their employer’s offices for 2-3 years and then return home.
Immigrants move with the intention of staying in the new country long term.
However, with the negative connotations attached to immigrants, some people - primarily white, highly educated people - incorrectly refer to themselves as expats, even once it’s clear they intend to stay.
I’ve seen a lot of online hate for expats
I pursued an engineering BSc with the desire to emigrate but got distracted by the success of SpaceX and wooed by the challenge of Mars colonization. Then the US health insurance industry got in the way, I failed out and didn’t make it back until COVID. I graduated in 2022 with the first university degree in my family but was crippled by student loan debt and unable to save to leave. Was finally able to escape the rural Midwest a year ago and made it to a city with plenty of aerospace companies right as everyone stopped hiring. The cherry on top was the CEO of the company whose engineering feats initially inspired me throwing fascist salutes at inauguration.
Odd jobs and parental support have mostly kept me afloat, but they can’t help forever and I am a few months out from having to move back. The military industrial complex slid into my DMs recently with the offer of a fat paycheck and loaded resume in exchange for my ethics and morals. They even dangled a carrot of potential transfer to a NASA climate science project after the contract is up, but I’ll be surprised if it’s still funded by then. Frankly, I broke down when I realized the project I’d be working on.
I’ll hear back about the position early next week and I’m desperately hoping it’s a no and I’m back to the drawing board, but if it’s a yes I’ll be starting in a couple weeks. The BBB will very likely lead to losing the best, most effective and enabling healthcare I’ve received so far, and the salary would cover the insurance plan I’d need to maintain that care. Its a short contract and the salary would also enable me to save enough to emigrate but I already feel compromised. I’ve dreamed of contributing to space exploration and am instead being bullied into contributing to it’s militarization by a country I’ve opposed for the entirety of my adult life.
I’ve looked into joining the Ukrainian Foreign Legionnaires and would much rather contribute to European defense against Russia, but I honestly just want to pursue an MSc or even PhD and turn my brain towards mitigating and adapting to climate change. I’ve worked so fucking hard, dreamed so fucking big and bounced back from defeat time and time again for this? Fuck.
Tl;dr: Masters/PhD in Sweden or Germany but barring that I’ll work for any European defense company that will take an american immigrant.
I have BS in stems but don’t have the qualifications for grad school unfortunately, another issue is I had a friend prior to pandemic that had a masters in the same degree, but the jobs were really lacking if you don’t have significant lab experience
Don’t come to Ireland. I’ve lived in the US for nearly two decades, made lots of friends and even helped some to immigrate here. The harsh reality is, however, that we’re going through a really bad housing crisis, with our own homeless numbers growing every month, and house prices and rents exploding (a recent statistic showed that our growth in rents is four times the EU average). So, please, for our sake and yours, try a different country.
